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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2011 9:12:48 GMT
On recommendation from Javier, i have purchased one of these:- cgi.ebay.co.uk/USB-Digital-Sound-Card-Musiland-Monitor-02-US_W0QQitemZ260437930872QQcategoryIt was delivered yesterday, and with a little help from Javier ( a very helpful new member from Spain, VERY knowledgeable computer wise, and speaks perfect English) it is now set up, and running in conjunction with Foobar, with the ASIO output plug in. This is my first dip in the water regarding "computer music" and to say i am impressed would be an understatement. Running through my Panda driving my Senns, its giving a lovely musical highly detailed, loaded with bottom end punch, presentation of the music, very enjoyable, and that`s only on low resolutions of input. There are two 3.5 HP output sockets high and low resistance, and using the portapro`s, give a very reasonable sound from the inbuilt Amp. Will download some better higher resolution music shortly to try, but as things stand i am one happy bunny. Plan to use this with my lap top computer eventually, as i am awaiting delivery of a decent on board pci soundcard for my desk top(Asus Xonar ESSENCE ST Internal Sound Card (PCI, EAX 5.0). Will take some photo`s, some "under the bonnet if i can" and post ASAP. Summing up at this stage, a very impressive little unit at very reasonable cost. Mick.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2011 8:38:47 GMT
I took som pics of the innards yesterday and was going to post them now but I just found I left the SD card home.
Inside there are some quality parts, for example, all the caps are Nichicon fine gold or Kxx (can't remember) 105º but most are tiny SMD.
The PCM1973 has voltage out like the ESS9022/9023 and I'd like to know if in Monitor the DAC it is driving the line outs directly or if the opamp (OP275) is in the path doing more than driving the HP outs but is bl*ody difficult to follow the tracks.
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Mar 5, 2011 11:33:53 GMT
How do you control the volume of the headphone outputs? With the ASIO driver, the PCs volume control is disabled because it bypasses Windows sound processor, so I can't see how that will work.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2011 13:00:01 GMT
ASIO bypasses the Windows mixer but you still get volume control. I f you are using one of the HP Outs of the Monitor 02 you can either use the player volume control (not recommended), Windows volume (neither recommended) or the volume control in Musiland's Control Panel. If you use the Line Out you just leave everything at 100% and use your HPA volume knob (as I do) Here are some pics of MM02 control panel: 1st Tab: 2nd Tab:
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Mar 5, 2011 17:07:40 GMT
Ah, OK, that must be something within Musilands own drivers, my USB DAC is driverless and when I'm using the media player with the ASIO plug in, all the software volume controlls are dissabled.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2011 18:09:14 GMT
Correct. Most USB DACs are Audio Class 1 and use Windows' own driver (0 soft developement costs) but Musiland is an Audio Class 2 device and Windows doesn't have drivers for it. All DACs capabale of >24/96 over USB use propietary drivers. Hera are some (crappy) pics I took of the inside: Its a pretty small box (my hand as reference). The actual board is red, in the pics they have in Musiland's, the shop Mick linked and most sites on the web it apperas blue. The Monitor 02 doesn't get its power from the USB like the 01 did but straight from the mains. This is another area were I think there is room for improvement.
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elysion
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Post by elysion on Mar 5, 2011 18:18:04 GMT
IIRC FauDrei has also a Musiland Monitor and has used it over longer time.
It would be interesting to hear about his exeriences with it.
BTW: Did someone try to connect it with a Mac or a PC with Linux? There's no official drivers support for these, but maybe a generic driver will do the job also.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2011 18:54:57 GMT
I have neither a Mac nor a Linux computer so I haven't investigated compatibility but I don't think a generic driver will work with the Musiland. Audio Class 2 standard was set a while back but is still far from being as widspread and well implemented as Audio Class 1. BTW, ASUS recently anounced at CeBIT a very interesting USB Class 2 DAC + HPA advertised as "Next Gen Audiophile Standard". Wonder if it'll better the ST/STX: If they are priced reasonably I'll consider getting one for my main system and use the Monitor for the bedroom.
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elysion
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Post by elysion on Mar 5, 2011 19:10:54 GMT
The ASUS Xonar Essence One looks nice!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2011 20:13:08 GMT
The ASUS Xonar Essence One looks nice! X2 , but having trouble trying to locate any info regarding its performance, specs,availability etc. The essence ST internal card is a work of art, can also replace op-amps to suit your own taste LME 49720HA`s going in mine, if it performs as well as it appears to be made, will be very happy, will get it installed next week. Mick.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2011 22:49:40 GMT
X2 , but having trouble trying to locate any info regarding its performance, specs,availability etc. It is only been presented at CeBIT (less than a week ago), it'll take a while 'till it is available for the general public. Before launch most probably they'll send samples to hardware reviewing sites. I hope it stays south of 200€.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2011 23:34:30 GMT
Personally, I would prefer mains power, even if via an SMPS, than typically crappy power from a USB port .That way they can give it additional filtering, and get around potential earth loop problems which can degrade performance without you really being aware of anything being amiss. Alex
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2011 0:10:09 GMT
Alex, I didn't mean I prefered USB power. Rather that maybe replacing the trafo and the "black box" you can see just above my little finger in the first pic with an outboard higher spec and better performing PS will make an improvement to its SQ.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2011 0:28:05 GMT
Alex, I didn't mean I prefered USB power. Rather that maybe replacing the trafo and the "black box" you can see just above my little finger in the first pic with an outboard higher spec and better performing PS will make an improvement to its SQ. Javier Yes, I had noted that,but it would cost a lot more for them to implement, as ready made internal SMPS are churned out by the millions.You will have seen from my thread about a JLH Linear +5V PSU for USB in the Computer area that I am 100% with what you are suggesting. Alex
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Will
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Post by Will on Mar 6, 2011 10:43:49 GMT
That Asus essence one looks very nice, and the headphone amp section looks like it's been thought about, too. It say's it is using a lme49600, which is designed to be used with the lme49710/20 and acts as current buffer, to deliver some serious drive to headphones.
There are a few diy amps based on it, and they are well liked by those who have made them.
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Post by rallychief on Mar 9, 2011 9:54:57 GMT
Hi everybody, first post here although been reading the forum for quite a while, I have a musiland 02, and now feel the need for something better, especially since being given an M Stage amp, have been considering the Valab NOS dac available on e bay, wondered what thoughts were, is their anything else worthy of consideration only really need 44.1 for music from cd ( laptop as drive ) and wma lossless files on offboard HDD, and 48 for dvd so I can watch a movie on the laptop, needs to be under or arround the the £200 mark
Thanks for any advice in advance Chris
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Mar 9, 2011 10:21:22 GMT
If you're going to spend the same amount of money on a replacement as your existing DAC cost, the chances are it will sound different, but not necessarily better. And if you ask "what's the best £200 DAC available?", you'll probably get as many different answers as there are DACs.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2011 10:31:39 GMT
Are you using driver 1.0.9 or later?
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Post by rallychief on Mar 9, 2011 11:50:33 GMT
Firstly I paid £80 for the Musiland 02, secondly I seem to have driver 1.06.0 ? as usual the control panel is playing up and won't open, it goes through ( Vista Premium ) to the window that says don't allow / allow this programme I click allow and nothing happens, have had to go through allow process twice in past to get it to work, now won't sart at all
For £80 the 02 is a very good piece of kit, but the M Stage seems to show up its deficiences what difference would running 1.09 driver make
Cheers Chris
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2011 12:28:06 GMT
From V1.0.9 onwards the drivers have a new "Precission mode", try it and see if it makes a difference. I haven't tried any drivers older than those as everyone at headfi agreed they were better. Now I'm using 1.0.13 and they are very solid and work extremelly well (you can see the control panel a few posts up) For the price this is a terrific DAC. (I got mine for £74 shipped) Don't have Vista so no idea why you can't access the control panel, maybe you don't have enough permissions. If you want to try them, first unplug the 02, uninstall current ones, reboot, install new drivers and only when finished connect the 02 again. ===================================== For those running W7 SP1 has some improvements to the USB 2.0 drivers, more info here: www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/542154/new-usb-audio-driver-from-windows-7-sp1After installiing it dplcat.exe reported a signifcant drop in latency an much fewer spikes.
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Post by rallychief on Mar 9, 2011 13:03:14 GMT
Hi javier, thanks for that, you don't have a link to the 1.0.13 update do you, I can't seem to find the Musiland update for 02 only 01 MD10-11 etc, I agree for the money it is terrific, being asyncronous 24/192 etc, just now though with the M Stage a Lehman Black Cube Clone and the Senn HD 600, something is lacking, and the 02 is the cheapest bit.
Their are a lot of people on head fi etc, extolling the virtues of the Valab NOS dac, saying its a giant killer, competes with 5x the price bla bla, so was wondering if it would, be sensible upgrade to the 02, but I know people on here have different views on these things so thought I would ask the question, the Valab I had in mind was the one with seperate power supply at circa £190, or the luxury one with built in upgraded power circa £150. all depending on opinion, has anybody here tried it, anybody heard anything else circa £150' £200 compared to 02 etc etc.
Cheers Chris
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2011 14:48:59 GMT
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Post by rallychief on Mar 9, 2011 16:37:20 GMT
Hi Javier, many thanks for that it is very much appreciated, have downloaded 1.0.13 will report back if any SQ improvement, this is indeed a cracking forum, wish I had the courage to post before.
In the meantime, does anyone have any thoughts on the Valab, or anything else to consider, anybody got a dac they want to sell that might up the anti a bit
Cheers Chris
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Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2011 17:04:09 GMT
Hi Javier, many thanks for that it is very much appreciated, have downloaded 1.0.13 will report back if any SQ improvement, this is indeed a cracking forum, wish I had the courage to post before. In the meantime, does anyone have any thoughts on the Valab, or anything else to consider, anybody got a dac they want to sell that might up the anti a bit Cheers Chris I can confirm that the 02 is a great little device, works and sounds great with the Foobar +Asio plug in, i am really impressed with the SQ out of all my Amps, using this device. I can also highly recommend the Asus xonar Essence ST on board sound card, only tried my HP`s straight out of HP socket so far ( you can set the output resistance to suit your particular HP`s) and it sounds extremely good, i will try some different op-amps next week as they are interchangeable on the card. . Mick.
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Post by rallychief on Mar 9, 2011 20:23:00 GMT
Hi Javier, Mick, now all up and running, precision mode set, seems their is a bit more inner detail, you mention asio, I read a thread somewhere suggesting that Wasapi was the add on to use with Vista, is that not correct?, Truth be known its possible my foobar 2K is not set up as well as it could be any resident Foobar experts on here, what you guys find incredibly easy, is not so when you get to my age.
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