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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2009 13:08:44 GMT
Nigel
You could enclose all of the bits you'll need in a suitable compact PC case that could be chosen to suit where it will be sited. I chose the mini-ITX as the case is tiny and also because I wanted to keep the BD drive mechanically separated. And my setup is/will be fanless.
My TT consisted of a Clearaudio Champion Level II with its attendant separate two-piece motor this fed into a phono pre-amp which itself is only a little smaller than the Mini ITX case. The pre-amp had its own matching-case power supply. This lot took up two shelves. Then there is the convenience of storage on one HDD. My CD collection is a little smaller than yours but still takes up 9 storage cases (which I now only bring out occasionally). LPs are another story altogether as you know.
Superb Sound and any track in your collection located within seconds is a major plus.
Syd
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Dec 10, 2009 13:59:11 GMT
What Syd and I are doing is building a PC specifically to playback music on. I can't quite decide if I can go without movies from the same box. This does complicate matter considerably though. I could happily build a music box with components available now. Music/movies hybrid is a little more difficult. Heh  I have (temporarily) in my possession a Keces DA-131 DAC (with replaced opamps), and a Little Dot Mk IV SE atm... perhaps that discussion should be in another thread... ;D So at the moment it's a choice between a patchwork quilt of computer peripherals I love making patchwork quilts ;D |
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Will
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Post by Will on Dec 10, 2009 14:31:38 GMT
Happy 600th post, Phil! Only 8400-odd until you catch Mike up ! I'd be interested in what you have to say about the keces and little dot, as they are new names around here. And you're spot on about the movie/music PC, much more to think about  |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2009 14:45:22 GMT
Will/Phil
If you have a look at my post above again you'll see that this latest incarnation of the Atom now has an onboard sound/graphics chip which enables this little wonder to process BluRay from a Bluray drive. Remember I haven't got my hands on it yet but apparently there's no problem.
Syd
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Will
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Post by Will on Dec 10, 2009 15:48:34 GMT
Syd, The Zotac boards are perfect, apart from one thing (for me). I'll be using the spdif from my audio card, but the zotac boards do not have a pci slot. If I remember correctly, you are going to be using the spdif from the motherboard. It's just down to my preference for using the spdif on the soundcard, is all.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2009 19:45:20 GMT
Will/Phil If you have a look at my post above again you'll see that this latest incarnation of the Atom now has an onboard sound/graphics chip which enables this little wonder to process BluRay from a Bluray drive. Remember I haven't got my hands on it yet but apparently there's no problem. Syd Syd Are you sure Playing BluRay needs quite a bit of horsepower normally. As you already have a BluRay writer, it would be a shame not to include video playback capability if possible.That is the way Phil suggests too. Alex |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2009 22:41:57 GMT
Will You're right of course if you want to retain a separate Audio card, I'm hoping the on-board latest processor does my job. Alex According to the supplier's sale description it does. See www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=53#ION-ITX-Cand I'm getting the Zotac ION-ITX-C Fanless 1.6GHz Atom N230 Mini-ITX Board with DC Input option shown on that page as its fanless and takes a non-ATX PSU, ready for the next mod. So here's hoping! Syd |
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Dec 10, 2009 22:45:55 GMT
Are you sure Playing BluRay needs quite a bit of horsepower normally. Syd is sure. Bluray doesn't actually need all that much horsepower relative to something like h264 playback. VC-1 (what I believe most bluray is), is quite lightweight in comparison. I believe the nvidia chips/cards will do vc1 acceleration. ATI ones don't, mostly because just about any recent pc will decode it fairly happily. The beauty of the ION chipset is that it has an onboard 8400(?) nvidia chipset, that will accelerate h264 content + vc-1. With my 8800gt, I get maybe 5-6% cpu usage when watching a 1080 h264 rip. Edit: beaten!
Any reason for not getting the dual core Syd?Will is right in that the zotac boards don't have a pci slot. I'm not sure if a 1x PCIe card will happily go into a 16x slot. The POV board has a pci slot, but I seem to recall it had some other fatal flaw that made it unsuitable for what I wanted. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2009 0:23:31 GMT
Only because this one is fanless and it will only be used for music and occasional Bluray so should be adequate. I also wanted to use the M350 case.
Syd
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Dec 11, 2009 3:17:18 GMT
Only because this one is fanless and it will only be used for music and occasional Bluray so should be adequate. I also wanted to use the M350 case. Hope it's sufficient  I'd go dual and throw a diff heatsink on there myself... Besides, even with the dual, I recall reading the southbridge (onboard 8400) puts out more heat. |
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rowuk
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Post by rowuk on Dec 12, 2009 23:02:23 GMT
I challenge ANY Vinyl addict to get their LP playback to resemble the original master tape on the same playback chain. I have taken part in several such ABX tests. NEVER did vinyl win in spite of some VERY impressive gear.
What always was apparent was the phase shift due to the tone arm geometry, the resonance of the moving coil cartridge, the inaccuracies in the RIAA preemphasis. Still in many cases there was a freedom from "hardness" that has characterized "cheaper" digital.
I do not believe that this is jitter. I think that cheap digital has RF in the signal and that drives the amplification crazy. Graham Slee documented such stuff with his wide band phono preamps. When RF gets into the signal, it will modulate it and cause artifacts in the pass band. Better filtering found in better players removes this garbage!
Unless we are comparing something to the original recording, we are only speculating about airy, slam, depth, width and all the rest. All of those things can be "improved" by adjusting the frequency response. With a record deck, loading the cartridge with resistance and capacitance found in cables can offer much more tweakability than the high level CD output.
The PC IS the future. My opinion is to get your vinyl ripped before it or the stylus support mechanism disintegrates. My $1,500 Van den Hul cartridge died 2 years ago..........................
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2009 23:38:21 GMT
Robin
Obviously, any RF can't get through the PC environment after being ripped, unless you are suggesting that there is RF stored along with the 1s and 0s , yet there have been large gains in SQ made when using anti noise and vibration techniques..
Alex
P.S.
Email sent.
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Nigel
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Post by Nigel on Dec 13, 2009 0:23:32 GMT
I have not heard any of the computer stuff but Alex said in his opening post, "I'll stick with my CD's." All I can say is that he must have a damn good CD player.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2009 1:03:53 GMT
I have not heard any of the computer stuff but Alex said in his opening post, "I'll stick with my CD's." All I can say is that he must have a damn good CD player. Nigel I have used far better than average CD players. Unfortunately, the old Marantz CD65 which had numerous added voltage regulators etc. added, became too temperamental because of it's age and IDP connector problems. However the rest of my system is far above average. The thing is that some people will have their own preferences, whether it is valve, or vinyl, and it doesn't matter how much scientific and other evidence is provided, that they will never have their opinions swayed one iota. If you enjoy vinyl more, that is your perogative. If Miguel enjoys Valves more, that is Miguel's perogative. If Robin prefers tape over vinyl, again that is his perogative, although I would tend to agree with him. Much the same could be said for peoples preferences about closed back headphones, and open back headphones, or even more so their choice in music. Whatever floats your boat ! All I can do is pass on some of my findings from the last 50 years or so, and interested members can either decide to either try them or reject them. Regards Alex P.S. As we found at a listening session yesterday, there is even a large gap between players simply being used as a Transport feeding a DAC such as, MF X-DAC V3 via SPDIF,when used with a far better than average system. A modified Oppo DV981HD SACD/DVD-A player sounded very good, but a Marantz SA11 SACD player sounded far better again ! (Biamped 100W/Ch amplifiers with front end balancing , into Infinity Speakers with Raal Tweeters and Custom (expensive !) Cross over networks . ) |
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toad
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Post by toad on Dec 13, 2009 13:28:25 GMT
Just out of interest. Those of you who prefer Vinyl to CD what CDPs are you using?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2009 14:56:01 GMT
Toad,
It may be more valid for people to state their turntable and CDP, as some will be heavily biased towards one or the other.
The last time I replaced my CDP it was in a bid to catch up my turntable. Although a huge step forward, still not there!
For the record...(excuse pun)
Meridian 506.24 CDP (new laser but o'wise standard)
vs
Manticore Mantra/Alphason XenonMCS/ATOC9mlII. (minimal tweakery)
If I had to buy modern equivalents, new, to the above I guess the turntable would be approx. twice the cost of the CDP.
So, based on outlay, not a very fair comparison ;D
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toad
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Post by toad on Dec 13, 2009 18:24:24 GMT
Toad, It may be more valid for people to state their turntable and CDP, as some will be heavily biased towards one or the other. Good point. The reason I asked the question is I am looking to upgrade my CDP but if you guys already have quality CDPs that are being trounced by Vinyl I'm more likely to go the ripping route and custom build a PC for WAV playback. That said, I am attracted to the Cambridge Audio 840c as a CDP and because of it's capability of being used as a DAC I could utilise that aspect of it at a later date and go down the PC route, which appeals to me for it's versatility. I love the idea of instant access to any album. Damn those MP3 players Sorry guys but vinyl holds little appeal for me as I would have to build a collection from scratch unless my parents loft contains any of the stuff I bought in the 70s and 80s but a lot of my taste in music then was questionable to say the least. LOL. Ian |
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Nigel
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Post by Nigel on Dec 13, 2009 18:50:05 GMT
Alex,
Of course I don't reject your findings. I hold you in the highest esteem & admire your wisdom & experience in this subject.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2009 20:14:04 GMT
Toad, It may be more valid for people to state their turntable and CDP, as some will be heavily biased towards one or the other. Good point. The reason I asked the question is I am looking to upgrade my CDP but if you guys already have quality CDPs that are being trounced by Vinyl I'm more likely to go the ripping route and custom build a PC for WAV playback. That said, I am attracted to the Cambridge Audio 840c as a CDP and because of it's capability of being used as a DAC I could utilise that aspect of it at a later date and go down the PC route, which appeals to me for it's versatility. I love the idea of instant access to any album. Damn those MP3 players Sorry guys but vinyl holds little appeal for me as I would have to build a collection from scratch unless my parents loft contains any of the stuff I bought in the 70s and 80s but a lot of my taste in music then was questionable to say the least. LOL. Ian Ian Just be wary of the laptop route and USB DAC. (It wasn't the fault of the Benchmark USB DAC) We tried that on Saturday. We played back from my best .wav files on a 32GB Corsair Voyager GT USB 2.0 pen, and the SQ was WAY below that from even the Oppo, when playing .wav files burned to a Kodak Gold CD-R from the same files on the Corsair !!! Alex |
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Post by toad on Dec 13, 2009 21:05:27 GMT
Alex,
I'm sorely tempted to go for the Cambridge Audio 840c and then when I have some cash build a custom audio PC. I have experience building PCs from scratch so I'd probably just go with parts you guys recommend. That way I could use SPDIF or optical out from a half decent PC soundcard into 840c as a DAC. I can worry about a better DAC at a later date... if at all LOL.
Besides, I won't be doing anything until the expense of Xmas is out of the way hehe.
Ian
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2009 21:34:41 GMT
Damn right. If I didn't have so many LPs I wouldn't bother either. I am not going to mess with/upgrade my LP nor CD playback sources any further. Computer audio is my next step, all the convenience of mp3 with the quality that CD always promised but didn't deliver. As long as we'll be able to obtain HQ files the future looks good. I'm even giving serious thought to killing off my beloved cassette facility. I've already reduced the deck collection (bit of a mad passion of mine) down to a paultry 5 machines  |
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Nigel
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Post by Nigel on Dec 14, 2009 12:39:18 GMT
Toad (Ian),
I don't want to give the wrong impression, I get very decent results from cd playback, for me though, vinyl gives me that little bit of extra musical satisfaction. If I was starting collecting from scratch it would be impossible to get everything I have on cd via LP.
I have a Rega Jupiter (good) & an Arcam Alpha 5 (excellent) which has been souped up.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2009 15:27:38 GMT
I agree %100 with you on this one Nigel, i have a highly upgraded Marantz cd 85 and 17KI, both sound superb in slightly different ways, but give me the musical presence that my vinyl setup gives, any day.
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leo
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Post by leo on Dec 14, 2009 15:41:58 GMT
Must admit I find vinyl rather addictive, tbh the noise does not bother me too much either, theres something very pleasing about it. Currently listening to Pictures at an Exhibition which I picked up for 50p from a car boot, its all good fun  |
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leo
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Post by leo on Dec 14, 2009 15:47:39 GMT
One thing I find interesting which I've found with vinyl is its more stick it on and enjoy it rather than farting about worrying about the recording quality unlike with digital  |
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