Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Dec 27, 2006 17:40:12 GMT
Just bought a DARKVOICE THA332 from China (five days delivery) for £200. I wasn't expecting that much to tell you the truth. I must say, I've been pleasantly surprised. Build is very good - like a brick sh*thouse springs to mind. Sound also very good: deep bass; nice open midrange; and clear treble. From memory, I'd say it's as good as the stock X-CAN V3.
They drive the HD650s effortlessly, and the dynamics are excellent, better than the unmodded V3. However, don't know how they'll sound with lower impedience cans like the GRADOs.
I suspect if the stock tubes were changed, there would be an improvement to the sound. (Tubes 2x6J1s and 2x6C19s, which, confusingly, is the Russian cyrillic for 6S19s.) I've seen some NOS 6S19P-Vs on E-Bay and some SVETLANA 6S19P-Bs. As for the smaller output tubes, there are a number of 6J1ps, again on E-Bay, and other compatable varities - 5654s, EF95s, 6AK5, etc. Any help here would be great.
I'll post some pics later.
Fergus
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Dec 31, 2006 14:55:55 GMT
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 31, 2006 17:26:54 GMT
The X-Can is way prettier can't comment on the amp since the tubes are a bit "off brand" and not commonly available. My normal preference in a tube amp is the vacuum tubes need to be readily available off the shelf in new versions and have enough NOS choices to have limitless oppurtunities for tube rolling.This satisfies both the "never happy/greener pasutres" crowd and the "I just want my work to play music" crowd with the first group the type that usually spends more time playing with replacement tubes then they do playing music. Replacing the tubes is no small part of owning a tube amp so should always be looked at as part of the operating cost plus convenience level.The day I need to E-Bay for tubes found no where else taking a chance on actually finding someone honest I hope someone slaps me silly So having crapped all over the amp (sorry man ) how's she sound ?
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Dec 31, 2006 19:11:53 GMT
Hey Rick, Replacement tubes for the DARKVOICE are readily available, and very cheap. I ordered 10 (yes 10!!) SVETLANA 6S19P-Bs (NOS) last night on E-BAY (DOH!!), and all for $19.99 (£9.98). Hopefully, these mil-spec "P-B" designated tubes will be better than the standard SHUGUANG 6C19s. I also bought a few PHILIPS/MULLARD 6KA5Ws black-plates to try out sometime down the line, and there are many 6J1 alternatives from RCA to SYLVANIA and RAYTHEON to TUNG-SOL. This little amp sounds great (although it does take a while to run-in): bass is very deep; mids are open and detailed; and the top-end is clear, though perhaps a little harsh. All and all, a good buy for £200. As for aesthetics... well, like everything, that's totally subjective. Maybe it's not as pretty as the V3, but it's better built, if a little rough round the edges, and sounds just as good.
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 31, 2006 19:23:53 GMT
I stand corrected then.not ever having used the tubes OR seeing them as a commonly available part with multiple manufacturers having done a version of assumed it was more of those far east "we used this because we CAN and you have to come back to us for the replacement" type tubes. glad you like the amp dude but to be honest I will never in my lifetime by an amp made in mainland China or any other country that does not play by the rules others have to follow so eve if they come out with a SUPER AMP will take a pass on principal alone.Yeah I'm a major prick,always have been glad for ya though rickster
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 1, 2007 2:18:13 GMT
Thanks Rick. To tell you the truth, I hadn't heard of this tube either. Like all these Communist countries, the 6J1 is probably a facsimile of a Soviet valve - 6J1p. Most of the other western equivilents (5654, EF95, 6AK5W etc) are used mainly in ham receivers and such like. The larger tubes, again a Soviet rip-off, are employed as voltage rectifiers - I think. So perhaps you're right - they're obscure Chinese tubes, and there use may have been prompted only by their availability, but, hey, they don't sound too bad - thank God! Don't know much about the politics of it, but it's a definite risk in buying something from China, especially buying blind. I mean, Chinese hifi - ha, ha!!! But I did some research - reading forums etc, and a variety of factors lead me eventually to the DARKVOICE. I think the risk paid off.
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Jan 1, 2007 2:56:25 GMT
i kinda hate to take this to a personal political rant but my main beef is first they come out with dirt cheap "clone" amps that no honest manufacturer can match in price so they farm out THEIR construction to the same country they can not compete with thus putting their very own customers out of work at which time the cheap labor country then clones THAT product now that they have the plans in hand and sell it back to the country of origin at an even cheaper price than the one that tried to cut cost initially. if this is a fair tade model I am fkn Mickey Mouse and I for one will never support any action that allows those with loot to cause the loss of work for those who have no control over such things-in short spoiled brats (no matter age) with the "I want and I want it cheap" no matter who it hurts mentality. sorry 'bout the rant but some things are just WRONG and someone needs to have the balls to say it every once in a while even if not a popular view. On that note I hope you enjoy the amp,really man
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 5, 2007 19:47:42 GMT
I tried a couple of Philips/Mullard Blackplate M8100s (NOS) in the DARKVOICE today, which I understand is a military version of the EF95. They sound fantastic - significantly better than the stock tubes. Bass, while not paticularly deeper, seems more solid and articulate; also more openess and detail; while the top-end has lost all the harshness. More experimentation needed, but I could happily live with these tubes - forever.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 7, 2007 13:57:36 GMT
Did you get it off ebay Fergus? I'm looking for a valve amp (not because I need one) and have been looking at this one cause I think it looks pretty....... if it sounds good too It'll be a bonus This one here
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 7, 2007 19:47:56 GMT
Yeah, Mike, I looked at this little amp when I was considering what one to buy. It's a little beauty - one of the nicest Chinese amps I've seen. The only thing that put me off, and a pretty crucial one at that, was that it appears to work better with lower impedience cans like the GRADOs and the SONYs. And, as a dedicated HD650 man, this was the deciding factor. I then moved on to the BADA PH12, a hybrid amp. Very good at driving the 650s. But when I e-mailed CATTYLINK about buying one, they told me that they were having trouble with them, something to do with the transistors blowing. He recommended the JOLIDA JD2 tube headphone amp with the dedicated JD10A tube PSU ($386). I then found out about DARKVOICE, and there latest amp the 332. I bought it off E-BAY, from a seller called Jasmine's Hifi Store. The price was $435, but they have a "make me an offer" button. I offered £200 and it was accepted. Five days later the amp was with me. If you're interested, simply type "DARKVOICE 332" into GOOGLE and Jasmine's name comes up. For £200, it really is a brilliant little amp, and, as I said above, it drives the 650s effortlessly. Plus, there are the endless possibilites for tube rolling.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 7, 2007 20:02:00 GMT
If you have a quick peek around the back of the T.M.S amp Fergus check out the load selection switch That's the one thing about this amp that does appeal to me
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Jan 7, 2007 20:09:26 GMT
looking at those load positions it either uses a Sowter 8655 or a damn close clone of one BTW-the "preamp" position would be 600 ohms
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 7, 2007 20:18:22 GMT
Yeah, Mike, saw that "impedance selector" when I first considered buying it. But the site I saw it on expressly said that it worked "better" with headphone with lower impedances.
Maybe I shouldn't have let fear creep in, but I did, and it eventually led me to not buying the amp.
It is a little beauty though. What kind of tubes does it take? Are they readily available? I ask because if I have a criticism of the DARKVOICE it is that the bigger tubes, the 6C19s (6S19s), while not difficult to obtain, are strictly available only from ex-Soviet sources. There appears to be no western version of this valve.
I think if you do decide to buy this little amp, you may be pleasantly surprised. Component quality is my amp is quite good, and the internals are very neatly wired. I'll post a pic of the internals to see what you think.
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 7, 2007 20:21:45 GMT
Here's a pic of the insides of the amp.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 7, 2007 20:33:05 GMT
Looks very well put together Fergus. The valves for the other one are 2 x EL84 and 2 x 6AK5 (Jan 5654?) so pretty much generally available last time I looked.
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 7, 2007 20:33:38 GMT
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 7, 2007 20:41:07 GMT
Yeah, those valves are very readily available and with many different brands. The 6AK5s, I know well - the DARKVOICE's output runs on two 6J1s, the "Communist" version of the 6AK5. Look out for the 6AK5W, the mil-spec version. I have a number of these coming very soon.
Other equivalents include, the 5654, EF95, M8100, CV4010, 6F32, 6J1P-EV, the list goes on and on. And they are very cheap. I got 5 of the M8100s (all closely matched) for $2.59, yes, £2.59!!!
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 7, 2007 21:09:34 GMT
Yeah, those valves are very readily available and with many different brands. The 6AK5s, I know well - the DARKVOICE's output runs on two 6J1s, the "Communist" version of the 6AK5. Look out for the 6AK5W, the mil-spec version. I have a number of these coming very soon. Other equivalents include, the 5654, EF95, M8100, CV4010, 6F32, 6J1P-EV, the list goes on and on. And they are very cheap. I got 5 of the M8100s (all closely matched) for $2.59, yes, £2.59!!! I'll have to sit down and have a good think about it. The darkvoice has a very good rep so is pretty known, I've always been a gambler and gone with the unheard of / lesser known. It's definitely a case of shooting in the dark with some of these unknown amps though.... you could bag yourself a nice juicy bird or you could end up blowing your foot off. The T.M.S amp "looks" good but that's all I have to go on, I think the earlier versions weren't too good with low impedance 'phones which is why the ad now says "Recommended For lower impedance headphones such as the GRADO ATH SONY" that doesn't mean to say it won't be good with Senns..... probably should have read "now recommended for use with Grado as well as higher impedance 'phones" Hell I could be wrong, could turn out to be a real pig's ear instead of the dog's bollocks....... I do feel a punt on something different coming on, just not sure what yet
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 7, 2007 21:39:37 GMT
Go on, gamble. You know you want to. ;D
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 7, 2007 22:39:05 GMT
Go on, gamble. You know you want to. ;D But what if............. nooooooooo! I can't gamble, I need to follow others, I live for flavour of the month. When they say "buy" I jump in and buy, when they say "sell" I'm first in the queue. I can't "gamble" Fergus, it's just not in my make up..... I always wait for someone else to try it before I jump on the bandwaggon.........
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 7, 2007 23:22:46 GMT
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 8, 2007 0:32:56 GMT
Good on you, man.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 8, 2007 12:45:32 GMT
Fergus, how does your DarkVoice sound compared to your X-CAN V3? I'd imagine it should sound quite different being warmer and more lush am I correct? You know, if I get the T.M.S and it sounds like the rest of my amps I'll be well pissed off I'm really hoping for a fluid and mellifluous coating to the sound.... do you get this euphony with your DarkVoice?
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 8, 2007 15:32:02 GMT
Yes, Mike, very "mellifluous and fluid", but, no, not particularly "warm". Very open, packed with detail, bass very deep, powerful, especially with the M8100 Mullard tubes. Initially, slight harshness to the treble, but again this has disappeared with the better tubes. How does it compare to the X-CAN V3? Unmodded, it betters it by some way. Modded, the differences are more subtle, but important. I think of it this way: the modded V3 presents a very detailed, fluid and beguiling picture of a small room. The DARKVOICE opens everything up: you hear little details on favourite recordings that you never heard before, and not only that but it's all placed within a more realistic soundstage. It may appear blasphemous to say it, because I'm still very fond of the V3, but this little amp, to my ears, is better. I bought it as a second amp, but it has now superseded the V3 as my first. Having said that, I don't know how the TMS amp will sound. I warn against hasty conclusions - a fault of mine - because my amp took an age to run-in. As soon as I heard it, I knew it had potential, but it sounded a bit harsh and closed in. I was ready to condemn everything Chinese. But as the days passed, and the sound improved, I became more and more enamoured of it. I've been won over. In fact, I think I'm in love.
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 8, 2007 21:48:45 GMT
Just had an e-mail from a guy whose's having problems (that's an understatement) with the 332. I'll quote his e-mail verbatum:
"Got the 332 and promptly fried it. They ship an unusable 110v cord. OK, so I used my step-down transformer with what I thought was the right power cord. WRONG it started smoking as soon as I switched it on... How did it fry if I was using 110v and the power cord was the wrong type?"
Any suggestions? I think the 332 may be self-biasing. Would using the step-down transformer interfere with this self-biasing process? I don't think the use of another power cable would cause the problem. Of course, there's always the possibility that the amp had an inherent fault and that nothing this guy did lead to the failure.
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