rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Jan 21, 2007 0:48:23 GMT
yeah ! Looks like THAT secret is safe ! ;D
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Post by PinkFloyd on Jan 21, 2007 1:11:15 GMT
yeah ! Looks like THAT secret is safe ! ;D They'll never suss out my latest incarnation
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Jan 21, 2007 1:21:01 GMT
Christ, Mike you've found me out!!! There's me trying to be all mysterious and secretive, but now I've finally been unmasked. I agree there's a lot of peace of mind to be had from a home-based guarantee. Although in Northern Ireland, there is a severe lack of reputable hifi shops, so if I were to take my X-CAN back for repair to the ONLY MF dealer, I'd have to drive to Dungannon, about 2 hours away by car, and because I don't drive about 3 hours by bus plus changes at Belfast and Lisburn, and then 3 hours back. Then you have to deal with the smarmy, always on the make, sales staff or owners, who probably won't fix the thing right anyway. I don't know, maybe I'm just trying to justify to myself buying the DARKVOICE. You right it is a risk, a f**king big risk, but if you're going to buy any Chinese brand, DARKVOICE is the one to buy. As far as I know they've been going for about 25 years, and I haven't heard of any catastrophic failures in their equipment (although saying that I've probably jinxed everything).
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Feb 5, 2007 22:00:37 GMT
Here's a better pic of the inards of the 332. And, Mike, you know where I said that DARKVOICE amps don't go with lower impedance cans? Well, I was wrong. Some guys on HEADFI have experimented with the 325is and RS-2s, and apparently they sound great. ;D
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 6, 2007 11:17:05 GMT
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Feb 6, 2007 21:20:37 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 6, 2007 21:34:11 GMT
Probably zero fergus, those two big honking 33uF SCR caps look like they're in series with the output unless I'm mistaken (ie: is one end of both of them connected to L & R at the headphone socket?) if so there'll be no DC offset. If they are in series then fitting higher capacitance here will be better for low impedance 'phones I'd imagine. 32 ohm load with 33uF will give a corner frequency of around 150Hz..... pur guesswork maybe Rick can chip in here to confirm... that "is" assuming the two 33uF are in series with the outputs.... the same 33uF with 300ohm load (sennheisers) will give a corner frequency of around 16Hz to achieve 16Hz with a 32 ohm load would mean using 300uF in this position which would also give the 300 ohm a corner frequency of 1.8Hz at the same time..... again, I may be talking bollocks here
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Feb 6, 2007 21:45:46 GMT
Are those SOLEN caps, Mike?
And those green cylindrical "things" below them, they resemble some Russian mil-spec PIO caps I have. Assuming they are caps, are they used to bypass the SCRs?
Did anyone have any difficulty accessing the site tonight?
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 6, 2007 22:20:49 GMT
Are those SOLEN caps, Mike? The two big black ones with SCR (Societe des Composants Record) written on them sitting adjacent to the headphone socket. is one end of them actually connected to the headphone socket?
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 6, 2007 22:50:50 GMT
Looking at the 336i it also appears to have 30uF in series with the output but instead of one cap per channel it uses 3 x 10uF film caps in parallel: I still haven't got my 336i yet (tracking report stopped as soon as it arrived in the UK / typical) but going from the pics of yours and this pic it does appear that 30uF is connected in series with the outputs. Two spare slots on the 336i PCB for another 10uF per channel and maybe a few uF paralleled on top of the PCB but, if these are output caps I think I'd rather one large value per channel and dispense with the PCB altogether to make room for the big film caps, maybe a couple of 125uF 400V Ansar supersounds..... they're £30 each and 5 inches long by two inches wide but by the looks of things they should fit if the PCB is ditched. Again, I may be talking bollocks here but if corner frequency is anything to go by then 125uF will give around 38Hz with a 32 ohm load instead of 150Hz with 32ohm load (with 33uF cap) 125uF will also give around 4Hz with a 300ohm load so maybe a better bet if you're using both low and high impedance 'phones. 250uF per channel would give you 20Hz with a 32 ohm load and 2Hz with a 300 ohm load but cramming 250uF of polyprop in may be difficult due to space. This is pure guesswork without actually seeing the amp in real life and I may be totally off the mark here but I'm pretty sure that 33uF is really only suited to >300ohm 'phones..... 33uF with a 600ohm load would give you a corner frequency of 8Hz for example. I await Rick to chip in and comment on the last few threads just to either A: confirm what I'm saying is correct B: I'm talking bollocks
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 6, 2007 22:57:51 GMT
Actually, the more I look at the pics the more I wonder if these caps "are" connected in series with the outputs
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Feb 6, 2007 23:45:55 GMT
film and foild caps and not too shabby either looks like there is a proper bias path to ground after the caps (the resistors on the jack) to prevent a charge buildup with no load connected,something that without you would get a loud CLACK if you pluged headphones in with the amp on. Good mid quality cap,proper resistor to gound,a proper output..........................for medium imedances ! No way the bass is extended into a low impedance load so while it may sound OK is more the way a mini monitor can sound OK but when compared to a full range system falls short without a bass speaker addition (no,they are not subs but bass speakers CALLED subs ) Couple of things to add. The output cap/headphones ohmage in resistance forms a single pole filter so slopes at a rate of -6dB per octave meaning the corner frequency is the -3dB DOWN point which is 1/2 the overall volume at that frequency and also means the signal will be down by 1.5 dB at double the filter corner and 0.75dB down at four times the frequency so if say the filter is hinged at 20Hz it will be -3dB @ 20Hz,-1.5dB @ 40Hz and -0.75dB @ 80Hz ! Throw in the wild card of the parallel inductance of the headphone transducer that if high enough will create another pole of attenuation and that former "flat" to 20Hz may not only be anything but flat but in reality may look like a dirt road for all the bumps (ripple) in the passband So not the simple "I want full bandwidth response to 20Hz so will filter at 15Hz" most think then toss in the designer trying to please "anycan" users and the choices become use a very large and expensive cap or idealise to a medium impedance load and have "useability" with lower impedance loads even if not will full bandwidth response. I have no problem personally with cap coupled stages until it gets into the "K" uf area because here the choices in capacitors is either use an electrolytic.the worst possible coupling cap type,or stack multiple high value film caps until you get there-VERY expensive,and why for tube based headphone amps meant to drive low impedance cans transformer coupling,with or without a series cap on the primary,is the only way to go. This "way" is usally a lot more expensive than any single cap coupled stage would be and why there are so few Grado-centric tubed amps available due to medium impedance outputs being a damn lot cheaper to deal with and a thing that by leaning out the bass even more makes most Grados sound totally upper octave dominant that in combination with the energy in the 3Khx/6Khz area gives the "overly bright" sound many report. using this calculator- www.muzique.com/schem/filter.htm30uF into a 32 ohm load gets you 3dB down at 166Hz (-6dB @ 83Hz,-12Hz @ 40Hz and -24dB down @ 20 Hz !!!!).Hardly good bass response I think
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 7, 2007 0:07:12 GMT
I was right then
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Feb 7, 2007 1:58:27 GMT
Rule #1-Mike is ALWAYS right Rule #2-See Rule #1
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Feb 7, 2007 14:17:48 GMT
A matched pair of RCA JRC5654/6AK5Ws (black-plates) arrived from the good old USA this morning. Just fitted them, and right from the off they sound great, but I'll leave any conclusions to they run in properly. They were made in 1962. Just think, I was a glint in my father's eye when they were made.
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Feb 7, 2007 23:09:31 GMT
dammmmmmmmmmn ! I know I was so whipped last night I was bumping into shit just trying to walk from a to B in my own house but seems my brain was also having difficulty connecting A to B Obviously -6dB per octave gives us -18 dB @ 40Hz not -12Hz at 40Hz ;D
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Post by eyez on Mar 1, 2007 15:01:58 GMT
Hello! Just registered to the site. I've been reading the thread of DV 332 on head-fi lately, but never posted there. rockgrotto site looks more friendly. I've been using Sennheiser HD595 + Xenos 3HA for more than an year. Now I want to upgrade both my cans and amp - going for Sennheiser HD650 + DV332. Here're my first questions: Does DV332 worth 400-500$ price, or I shoud look for something better in this price range? and what is the russian equivalent of M8100/CV4010? PS: I'm not sure, if the new members of the forum have to idroduce treirselves, but if so - short version - I'm a 31 years old engineer from Bulgaria, working in a pharmaceutical company.
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Mar 1, 2007 19:58:33 GMT
Hi, Eyez. Welcome to the Rock Grotto. Don't be put off by Head-Fi. I post there on the 332 thread under the name Godkin (some other guy had the user name Fergus). Come and join us, but also stay here - some great tips on mods and stuff. The 332 with the HD650 is a super combo. The 332 excels with higher impedance cans, like the SENNHEISERs and BEYERDYNAMICs. The synergy with lower impedance cans is less certain - some say yes, some say no. Consensus here, says no. Mike and Rick, who have a massive ammount of technical knowledge, conclude that the output stage of the 332 is designed with higher impedance cans in mind. I tend to agree with them. Personal recommendations are tricky as they are personal. I can only comment on my own experience. The 332 is better than the MF X-CAN V3, both in its standard and modded incarnations. But there are plenty of alternatives - WOO AUDIOs 3 and 6 headphone amps or the MG OTL Mk3 headphone amp. I'm sure others here can chip in for good Solid State designs. If you want to go Chinese there is the hybrid BADA PH12 or the solely tube CONSONANCE (can't remember the name). The Russian equivalents of the M8100 are the 6J1P and its mil-spec brother, the 6J1P-EV. If buying any one of these, go for the latter - much better both technically and sonically. But, truthfully, the western versions are better: they have a sweetness allied to crispness that the Russian valves do not. My personal favourites, as I'm sure you know, are: the PHILIPS/MULLARD M8100 and its military brother the CV4010 (Black-plates); the MULLARD EF95; and the RCA 5654/6AK5W (Black-plates).
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Post by eyez on Mar 2, 2007 10:22:21 GMT
Hi, Fergus! Thank you for the quick and nice reply! I'm not used to the audiophile slang /my english is not good too/, but I'll try to do my best and make my thoughts understandable. I've loved music for all of my life, but started to pay attention to the quality of the sound about an year, or two ago. Then I got the Sennheiser HD595 + Xenos 3HA. Well, they're not bad, but sometimes I feel them too brute to my ears. Nice and clear sound over all, but the highs are too strong, while the bass is a bit weak. I don't like to tweak the equalizers and listen to the music flat, as the musicians played it. HD595 are good for rock and some acoustic genres, but not that good with the electonic music IMO. This is one of the reasons for me to look around for for a new cans+amp combo. As I am sure that my next headphones will be Sennheiser again, I am quite sure about the amp /at least I wasn't util your reply/. I want to try a tube amp, because I've read some reviews about the nice sound of this kind of amps. I just wanted to be sure that DV 322 is a good tube amp and my money won't be as we say "blown by the wind", because I've read some stories about Chinese amps built with cheap low quality parts. I asked you about Russian equivalents of the tubes, because it's easy and cheap to find them here /I'm sure you know why /. For an example 6S19P-W costs 2ˆ, 6J1P-EW - 1.45ˆ, EF95 - 0.5 ˆ. PayPal doesn't work for Bulgarians too. When I ask them why and when would include Bulgaria their list, the answer was - "We are not sure." So scratch the ebay trade for me for the time being. Well, my next newbie questions will come when the amp is in my hands. Sorry if I bothered you, Eyez / Dimiter (my real name)
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Fergus
100+
Done a David Ike and is now known as Godkin
Posts: 197
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Post by Fergus on Mar 2, 2007 11:23:38 GMT
The DV332 is built really well: heavy chassis, point-to-point wiring, and a sprinkling of very good components. The only thing that "cheap and nasty" are the stock valves - 2x6J1s and 2x6C19s (which you know is the cryllic for 6S19). But they can easily be changed to better types - I'm using 6S19P-Vs from the Ulyanovsk plant in Russia and two MULLARD CV4010s - great combo. The SVETLANA 6S19P-Vs are also very good. If you get your 332, and want to change to stock valves, try these two as I think they're the best. The "P-V" suffixes mean that they are better engineered and more durable. As I said before, the 332 and the SENNHEISERs are a perfect match - you certainly wouldn't be disappointed. If you're lacking bass with your current set-up, then the 332 has bass by the bucket load. The better your choice of valves the more solid and extended the bass becomes. The 332 has also great "drive" and powers the HD650s with ease (if you want to stay with the Senns and improve upon your HD595, you're obviously thinking of the HD600 or HD650s). The mid-range has all the openess you'd expect from a valve amp, and the treble shimmers like you'd expect. For the money, a very impressive piece of kit. Another amp you could consider is the SKORPION HV-1. Haven't heard it, but it "looks " good and it's made quite close to you in Poland. Here's a link: rockgrotto.proboards39.com/index.cgi?board=b&action=display&thread=1170534148Good luck with your search for a new amp. Personally, I don't think you'd be wasting your money with the 332 and something like the HD650s, or other higher impedance cans: it well worth the money. I know it's hard to overcome prejudices against Chinese hifi - until recently I was struggling with the same thoughts when I was looking around for a new headphone amp - but the 332 is well built (it weighs 5kg) and sounds great.
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Mar 2, 2007 23:53:08 GMT
seconded.Hope you enjoy your stay here. We try very hard to avoid audio snobbery and get to the guts of enjoying music so the gear is more the means to get there.If it plays music and is a good buy we are into it rather than trying to dicsuss the finer points of tube rolling a $10,000 amp that is usually so jittery it needs to be coddled just to operate as adverised. Any questions you have on anything audio ask way
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Post by eyez on Mar 3, 2007 13:22:39 GMT
Thank you for the warm welcoming, guys! I feel that I come to the right place. That's exactly the way I think! I'm not one of those folks who follow trends and get all of the new stuff released on the market. I always buy things that work best for their prices, in this case - DV332 amp.
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xerxes
Been here a while!
Posts: 1,115
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Post by xerxes on Mar 4, 2007 18:48:02 GMT
Before you splash out on a new amp you could try the HD650s with your Xenos amp. You mention that you don't like the high notes with the HD595, well the HD650s sound completely different. I had a pair of HD595s and quickly got rid of them, I really didn't like them, they sound way too harsh for my liking and they are the only pair of Sennheisers I've tried that I didn't like. I replaced them with a pair of HD650s which are rich and smooth with much more bass in comparison to the thin, screechy sounding 595s.
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