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Post by szoze on Apr 6, 2012 15:25:09 GMT
Panasonic has a line of electrolytic capacitors called FR with higher ripple current, lower ESR and longer lifetime. Has anyone tried these in their x-cans? Any benefits?
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XTRProf
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Pssst ! Got any spare capacitors ?
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Post by XTRProf on Apr 6, 2012 16:32:01 GMT
At those kind of prices, just try it, man! Anyway, it's a Panasonic, isn't it? For me, I prefer to have a mixture of BG, Cerafine, Muse and Panasonic in the circuit so that it will not have a defined sound signature.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 6, 2012 19:27:07 GMT
Yes, I have tried them and they are not at all bad. There is a thread here somewhere about them where I fitted them into an X-CAN V1. Good quality caps and have the signature Panasonic house sound which is liquid and flowing.
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Post by szoze on Apr 6, 2012 21:22:20 GMT
Thanks. Are they as good as FC?
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Post by szoze on Apr 6, 2012 22:22:38 GMT
At those kind of prices, just try it, man! Anyway, it's a Panasonic, isn't it? For me, I prefer to have a mixture of BG, Cerafine, Muse and Panasonic in the circuit so that it will not have a defined sound signature. I will use Nichicon Muse in the output stage 2x470uF in parallell per channel (have you got my PM Mike?  ). Right now I have FC capacitors in the rectifying part of my X-Can but I have decided to re-cap my friends v3 with the FR ones. |
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 6, 2012 22:38:55 GMT
Thanks. Are they as good as FC? I feel like slashing my wrists...... |
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 6, 2012 22:46:47 GMT
OK... you've caught me with my pants down and shotgun to head..... I can only say one word and that is:
FM
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 6, 2012 22:57:09 GMT
Let me die in peace.
FC has always been my favourite (By the way)
Mike.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2012 23:23:28 GMT
Krisno... Krisno, Krisno..... Don't you like me Mikey..... halcion days.... FC V FM? leave me alone please, I'm not well. There's always the EE, TA, TP, HD etc. I've just noticed they have KS.....Krisno Series, they must be the best! AGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhh  |
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XTRProf
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Pssst ! Got any spare capacitors ?
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Post by XTRProf on Apr 7, 2012 0:27:38 GMT
I'm going to .............  to release steam after my firing!  |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2012 3:19:30 GMT
At those kind of prices, just try it, man! Anyway, it's a Panasonic, isn't it? For me, I prefer to have a mixture of BG, Cerafine, Muse and Panasonic in the circuit so that it will not have a defined sound signature. I will use Nichicon Muse in the output stage 2x470uF in parallell per channel (have you got my PM Mike? ). Right now I have FC capacitors in the rectifying part of my X-Can but I have decided to re-cap my friends v3 with the FR ones. FR should be good if you enjoy "etched" treble.  |
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Post by szoze on Apr 7, 2012 7:02:23 GMT
OMG, I am loosing my mind too! FK, HD, HC, HB, HA, TP, TG, TK .................... I lost it  |
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Post by szoze on Apr 7, 2012 7:50:17 GMT
FR should be good if you enjoy "etched" treble. Is it the combination of FR and Muse you are aiming at or is it something else? Have you tried FR/Muse combination?  |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2012 8:08:15 GMT
No.It's the use of extremely low ESR capacitors in PSUs for analogue areas. These are mainly designed for SMPS.
They will sound far from neutral.
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Post by szoze on Apr 7, 2012 8:27:50 GMT
No.It's the use of extremely low ESR capacitors in PSUs for analogue areas. These are mainly designed for SMPS. They will sound far from neutral. OK But isn't it the case with FM and FC too? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2012 8:51:20 GMT
Hey, are you trying to get me into a shitfight with Mike ? Low ESR PSU electros can be beneficial with valve amplifiers in particular, that may need a smidgin more HF, but don't overdo it by using electros with extremely low ESR, as claimed for the FR series. HF may end up a little too exaggerated and ultimately fatigueing to listen to for long periods. Alex |
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Post by szoze on Apr 7, 2012 9:01:08 GMT
Hey, are you trying to get me into a shitfight with Mike ?  |
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Post by szoze on Apr 7, 2012 13:41:47 GMT
Low ESR PSU electros can be beneficial with valve amplifiers in particular, that may need a smidgin more HF, but don't overdo it by using electros with extremely low ESR, as claimed for the FR series. HF may end up a little too exaggerated and ultimately fatigueing to listen to for long periods. Alex Then I gusess Nichicon FG or Elna Silmic are more appropriate in the power supply of the X-Can. |
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 7, 2012 21:00:28 GMT
Low ESR PSU electros can be beneficial with valve amplifiers in particular, that may need a smidgin more HF, but don't overdo it by using electros with extremely low ESR, as claimed for the FR series. HF may end up a little too exaggerated and ultimately fatigueing to listen to for long periods. Alex Then I gusess Nichicon FG or Elna Silmic are more appropriate in the power supply of the X-Can. Don't waste money. Panasonic FC / 1500uF 35V are the best if you are looking at "SOUND QUALITY" improvements. Trust me on this one. |
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Post by szoze on Apr 7, 2012 21:34:32 GMT
Don't waste money. Panasonic FC / 1500uF 35V are the best if you are looking at "SOUND QUALITY" improvements. Trust me on this one. Thanks Mike. I have FC in my X-Can v3 and I can't hear any problems in HF. I think the amp sounds just fine and clearly better then with Jamicon caps. I will also test the FR caps in my friends X-Can (it is 2200 uF by the way ) and compare. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2012 23:23:35 GMT
Don't waste money. Panasonic FC / 1500uF 35V are the best if you are looking at "SOUND QUALITY" improvements. Trust me on this one. Thanks Mike. I have FC in my X-Can v3 and I can't hear any problems in HF. I think the amp sounds just fine and clearly better then with Jamicon caps. I will also test the FR caps in my friends X-Can (it is 2200 uF by the way ) and compare. Make sure they have exactly the same type and brand of valves too. Mike has a huge amount of experience in this area, and if he says FC sounds better in this HA, then I will take his word for it. Mike has far too many highly positive reports about the MF amplifiers that he has modified. |
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Post by szoze on Apr 8, 2012 5:12:49 GMT
Make sure they have exactly the same type and brand of valves too. Mike has a huge amount of experience in this area, and if he says FC sounds better in this HA, then I will take his word for it. Mike has far too many highly positive reports about the MF amplifiers that he has modified. I will. The valves are Tesla E88CC NOS, similarly worn. The FR transistors are soldered in my friend's can, burning in right now. We will use AKG 701 and Senn HD650 when comparing. The problem is we can only compare Pana FC to FR capacitors, I don't have Nichicon or Elna.  So I cannot actually say whether FC are better than other brands/esr levels (to my ears) . Rated difference in ESR between FR and FC is 0,004 Ohm (0,014 for FR and 0,018 for FC). The difference in esr is not huge. A couple of hours after the soldering work with FR was done and the amp was on for about two hours my friend and I listened a little bit through k701. The amp sounded fine, and my friend said it probably already sounded better than with Jamicon caps. I am not sure if we can trust our audio memory. We will have a more thorough listening session tonight. Then we will also compare FC to FR capacitors.  |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2012 6:26:42 GMT
It's not just the ESR. Different formulations sound different, as Mike will attest. I would never use a capacitor like the FR in the bridge rectifier area of a good SS amplifier.
Alex
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Post by szoze on Apr 8, 2012 7:56:21 GMT
It's not just the ESR. Different formulations sound different, as Mike will attest. I would never use a capacitor like the FR in the bridge rectifier area of a good SS amplifier. Alex OK. But is it because FR really sound bad or because you are aware of it's technical specs?  |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2012 8:17:34 GMT
It's not just the ESR. Different formulations sound different, as Mike will attest. I would never use a capacitor like the FR in the bridge rectifier area of a good SS amplifier. Alex OK. But is it because FR really sound bad or because you are aware of it's technical specs? To put it simply, they are not designed for that kind of use. However, if YOU like what you hear, then I guess that's all that matters. Alex |
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). Right now I have FC capacitors in the rectifying part of my X-Can but I have decided to re-cap my friends v3 with the FR ones. 
So I cannot actually say whether FC are better than other brands/esr levels (to my ears) 
