mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 23, 2011 10:33:58 GMT
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XTRProf
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Pssst ! Got any spare capacitors ?
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Post by XTRProf on Sept 25, 2011 0:59:42 GMT
Wow, changing amp practically once a month, eh? Yeah, write your "shit". This is expected of RG members. Z is not RG as he has not morphed into RG yet.
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elysion
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Post by elysion on Sept 25, 2011 10:12:02 GMT
I had a quick look on the article from Tyll Hertsens. The pics of the Apex Butte PCB doesn't show much components at all. Are there expensive components on the PCB? The pics are not detailed enough to indentify the components.
I can't comment about the SQ of the amp. But 495$ is a lot of money for an amp. IMO the price is a bit OTT for such a PCB with only a few components on it.
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 25, 2011 13:24:08 GMT
The Butte has about 85 hours of burn in. I started comparing it to a Solo SRGII w/ the PSU1 a couple of hours ago fed from the same DAC, music and cables. For cans I was using the HiFiMAN HE300 w/ the HE6 OCC cable and the Superlux HD661 with the Grado RS-1 on cue to be the next can. The music was by Jim Hall, Jimmy Smith, and the Jazz at the Pawnshop CD.
For about an hour I thought the SRGII and the Butte sounded very good and it was just a matter of preference in sound reproduction. The differences I heard were not pronounced and could be summarized by stating the Butte ...
1. The treble is a bit more extended. 2. The soundstage is a bit narrower. 3. Not as mellow sounding. 4. The music is presented closer, as in being in the front row versus the 10th row in a venue.
So everything was going fine and all of a sudden the Butte started sound "confused" and not very coherent. I will wait about 12 hours hoping that it just needs more time to settle via burn in.
I have not opened the Butte yet so I do not know what components are inside. May do so in the next week and post the pictures. I need to ship this unit to the next tester on October 4th.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 25, 2011 14:08:31 GMT
The "butt" should go well with the "assguard"
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elysion
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Post by elysion on Sept 25, 2011 14:21:27 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 25, 2011 14:42:41 GMT
Holy crap (staying on the "butt" theme) not a lot going down in there, is there?
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 25, 2011 14:54:11 GMT
Video here:
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leo
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Post by leo on Sept 25, 2011 16:35:59 GMT
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 25, 2011 21:23:38 GMT
Yes, Tyll did post pictures. I meant I have not taken any pictures of the gear myself, if I did so they would be a bit higher capacity and hopefully you can read the components. As far as looking like $495, well ... I am sure that just about any piece of gear built in the many parts of the world cost far more than the sum of its parts. The real question is, does it sound as good or not as similarly priced units? Only each individual user would be able to asses after listening and comparing side by side. I believe it sounds as good or better than other $500 USD units (as sold in the USA). Since I have the Solo SRGII and frankly I find its warmer/mellower presentation more to my liking then I would not be buying the Butte. Cheers.
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 25, 2011 21:25:06 GMT
Hi Leo, I am not a technical person and would appreciate a bit of an explanation on what your post means. Thanks.
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 25, 2011 21:32:34 GMT
It appears the "weirdness" in the Butte went away with an additional 12 hours of burn in. This is good since I liked the sound straight out of the box and throughout the first 80 hours or so.
I moved to the Grado RS-1 with flats instead of bowls. The Butte has indeed a more in your face presentation, for now I prefer the mellower and warmer presentation of the Solo SRGII. I should mention that the sound differences are not significant and some/many may prefer the Butte's presentation. My wife listened to both amps via the RS-1 and depending of the music one amp sounded better to her than the other. She did agree the Butte has a slightly narrower presentation with a more extended treble.
BTW, for music I used:
1. Jimmy Smith 2. Jim Hall 3. Jazz at the Pawnshop 4. Fourplay
The DAC used was the one included in the HLLY SMK-II via the fixed RCA outputs. The music was fed via USB from an iMac 21.5 using apple lossless files using iTunes 10.4.1
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leo
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Post by leo on Sept 26, 2011 19:04:42 GMT
Hi Leo, I am not a technical person and would appreciate a bit of an explanation on what your post means. Thanks. Hi Miguel The operational amplifiers (op-amps) in the Butte are supposed to be capable of driving quite high current loads so should manage a wide range of cans ok without lots of external active circuitry , this makes the component count a bit lower, you just need the required voltage sources to power it (regulation ) set the gain of the op-amps etc. How well the OPA552's actually work is something I don't know, never tried them. I find an amp that goes bright can in some cases be suffering from instability . The little fets on the output (normally called classA mod) is usually a simple tweak of sticking a CRD,CCS from the op-amps output to the supply pin with worse PSRR, its just a little trick to clean things up. Basically the chosen parts in this amp enables a simple circuit not requiring loads of bits making the thing cheaper
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elysion
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Post by elysion on Sept 26, 2011 20:53:01 GMT
Exactly. For 495$ you should get at least five of these amps.
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elysion
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Post by elysion on Sept 26, 2011 20:54:33 GMT
Although the components are absolutely not equal or similar, the PCB reminds me a bit of that of the PreSonus HP4 amp.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 26, 2011 21:33:15 GMT
Are you STILL feeling obliged to comment on the free "bung"? I gave up on that bad vibe ages ago
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 26, 2011 23:25:05 GMT
Are you STILL feeling obliged to comment on the free "bung"? I gave up on that bad vibe ages ago The SRGII is the closest SS amp I have in terms of cost to the Butte and thus why I chose it as a point of comparison. Of these two amps I prefer the sound from the SRGII w/ PSU1 and my wife prefers the sound from the Apex Butte. No obligation just what I hear.
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elysion
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Post by elysion on Sept 27, 2011 0:02:50 GMT
What about some REAL competition? Panda, Neco MOSFET/BOSSFET, AUNE, matrix m-stage, V-Can (to name only a few)
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Post by UzminiNu on Sept 27, 2011 2:18:46 GMT
Even a GUANZO amp should be added to the list...no joke i feel it has more power as the amp part in the Aune DAC:}.
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 27, 2011 10:28:13 GMT
What about some REAL competition? Panda, Neco MOSFET/BOSSFET, AUNE, matrix m-stage, V-Can (to name only a few) Unfortunately I will be sending this amp back next Monday so I do not see any chance of getting any of the above amps in time to compare them. I know some do not care for the Graham Slee house sound, I happen to be one who enjoys it.
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toad
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Post by toad on Sept 27, 2011 15:08:22 GMT
Nothing wrong with the Solo. I laugh everytime someone knocks it tbh. Maybe if you actually compared it to the some of the latest Wonder Amps you'd get a bit of a shock.
The Solo is the favourite amp in my collection and has fought of competition from the Bravo, Aune and Panda and GSPs own Novo.
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