V2 PCBs

[kittenyberk]

Right then, after doing more mods on my V2, with horrid ROHS solder, well, I very nearly made myself a lovely paperweight, put it that way. ;D

So, I got to thinking, Given the fairly obvious issues namely the heat/scorching, The (IME) fairly poor pads (in that they'll lift, if you so much as look at them funny) and, well, I'd like a bit more space for some components to make for more viable cooling.

anyway, enough rambling.

Reckon it'd be worth investigating going that last step and making my own V2 PCBs?

I figure it should be fairly simple as they're only single layer, and pretty basic as far as these things go.

_{Obviously, they'd be completely one-off, the last thing i want to do is rip MF off.}


Note: This may be a post from someone who's had a V2 connected to his head in some way or another for probably 4 years solid

[kurt6652]

I recently did the Elna cap upgrade on mine and the pcb was in poor shape with scoorching near the tubes. I also had problems with the pads and traces. It would be great to be able to replace my board with a new one.

[XTRProf]

Well, you can always have the auto fan option as detailed by another member here. However, I'm not sure whether that will be solving the problem and creating a noise feedback problem.

I dunno but I find small is cuter!

[Deleted]

Perhaps an identical PCB pattern, but with 2 oz copper, then a bit more attention to ventilation ?
SandyK

[kittenyberk]

I don't really like the idea of fans, they have an odd habit of sucking in dust, not to mention ones small enough to fit the job will either whine or push next to no air.

That's without getting into the other noise making issues of them.

I'm thinking modded case (rely on convection to provide some airflow) and a perhaps making a shiny new pcb that's full of holes.

Edit:

sandyk said:

Perhaps an identical PCB pattern, but with 2 oz copper, then a bit more attention to ventilation ?
SandyK

That's pretty much the way I'm thinking, maybe some minor pcb mods, just to allow for fatter caps etc, but no real design changes.

[XTRProf]

kittenyberk said:

I don't really like the idea of fans, they have an odd habit of sucking in dust, not to mention ones small enough to fit the job will either whine or push next to no air.

That's without getting into the other noise making issues of them.

I'm thinking modded case (rely on convection to provide some airflow) and a perhaps making a shiny new pcb that's full of holes.

Well, as long as have holes, whether forced draft or convection will bring dust into the unit. Only the degree. The older CRT TVs with normal convection also have major dust problems onto the TV circuit boards. Fyi.

Anyway, just do the way u feel most comfortable with.

[kurt6652]

I drilled some holes in the board in areas that had no traces. I hope this allows some of the heat to rise up from below the board instead of cooking it like before.

[PinkFloyd]

Use 60/40 solder (low melting point) and solder the joints FAST..... if you are removing pads then you are holding the iron on the joint for way too long.

[Deleted]

Use 60/40 solder (low melting point) and solder the joints FAST..... if you are removing pads then you are holding the iron on the joint for way too long.

EXACTLY !
Grab a roll or 2 of this good stuff in the smaller size, such as .7mm.
It may become harder to get due to E.U. legislation (and elsewhere) gone mad.
Reminder to Self : Get another roll,too.

SandyK

[PinkFloyd]

This is the best I have come across AND it's cheap

Go with 22 SWG

Lead free solder is SHITE and a BASTARD to work with.... avoid it like the plague. As SandyK says....... stock up on 60 / 40 while you can.

Lead free is a recipe for disaster, a bastard to work with and sounds CRAP..... do a google for "tin pest"

ROHS, as far as I am concerned equates to RUBBISH ON HOURLY SESSION..... ie: unreliable "lead free" CRAP making it's way into Landfill sites every hour.....

Classic, lead rich designs have been in service for tens of years and will remain in service for many more years.... this ROHS lead free, throwaway shite will require a much deeper hole than quality leaded ever did.......

Wankers..... the same assholes that claim MDF furniture is more "planet friendly" than chippendale........ bloody IDIOTS! ;D

[leo]

Lead free solder gets through your iron bits like buggery too it requires loads of flux and makes the joints look shite, sounds shite, messy shite

Conclusion, SHITE!!!

[XTRProf]

Hey,

Are those Wonder Solder and Silver content ones ROHS as well? Ya, with lead the solder joint looks wonderfully shiny.

[Deleted]

ARTICLE.
"Lead-Free Solder-A Train Wreck in the making"

mae.pennnet.com/Articles/Article_Display.cfm?Section=ARTCL&ARTICLE_ID=238657&VERSION_NUM=2&p=32

Tin whiskers can be a major problem. In my career with Telstra, (Australia's now privatised Telecommunication's Carrier) I had to replace several hundred relay springsets due to tin whiskers growing , and causing a short circuit to the frame of the relay set. Towards the end of my career , I found that these "whiskers" being very fine, could be vapourised by applying a charged electrolytic capacitor across the fault. Often , you couldn't even see the resulting spark as the capacitor discharged into the whisker. These tin whiskers, must have cost Telstra alone, many hundreds of thousands of dollars to repair. To say nothing of the degradation to service caused by these tiny whiskers. Sometimes even causing 1,000 customers at a time, to have no telephone service for a period of time.
SandyK

[kittenyberk]

admin said:

Use 60/40 solder (low melting point) and solder the joints FAST..... if you are removing pads then you are holding the iron on the joint for way too long.

I know this, I blame the rohs solder entirely, I've not had pads lift in *years*, until this new solder.

Fortunately, my hearing is crap, so i can't hear the difference between them.

Still, I've just ordered a pound of the solder you recommended

[Deleted]

kittenyberk
You may not notice a difference between them initially. But a few years down the track you most likely will. Probably happen much sooner with gear that runs pretty hot, like the V2 does.
SandyK

[PinkFloyd]

I've been modding some of the more recent X-Can v3's and they're lead free across the board..... the lead free v3's sound SHITE compared with the fully leaded versions (they really do!) and I go out of my way to suck all that crap off of every pad and reflow with good old 60/40..... WHAT an improvement!!

Not only is the lead free solder a bugger to work with (ie: major heat required to melt it) it also sounds like dung and feels more like you're actually aralditing the joint together rather than flowing in some lovely shiny 60/40.

I don't give a SHIT what the green brigade have to say in favour of unleaded solder it's Shite, pure shite and nothing but shite...... period.

Quite a lot of the unleaded components sound shite too (compared with their leaded brothers) so I have stocked up with plenty of old school components..... my "budget" X-Can v2 upgrade kit is fully leaded and fully legal as it's for existing "vintage" equipment www.rock-grotto.co.uk/xcan-v2-upgrade-kit.htm ........ The feedback has been nothing short of excellent and I'm considering going with this as THE one and only upgrade kit I'll supply.... to hell with the "budget" label...... this kit will be renamed FULLY LEADED.

The Panasonic FM kit still has the edge (only just) but only if fitted with the solder I supply with the kits..... it sounds pretty damned muddy and undefined if you decide to join everything together with that lead free crap and you run the risk of lifting all the pads attempting to get the shite to flow.

I am SO anti ROHS I'd like to drown the buggers that implemented this directive in a large bath of molten solder and personally whack them over the head with a large bar of leaded solder until they drown................ assholes!

[insomniac]

sandyk said:

kittenyberk
You may not notice a difference between them initially. But a few years down the track you most likely will. Probably happen much sooner with gear that runs pretty hot, like the V2 does.
SandyK

Like Microsoft's Xbox360...repeated heating and cooling of the console caused the lead free solder to fail. Mine packed in at 14 months and because the warranty had expired I was billed £75 for the repair.
Months later Microsoft admitted the solder fault and extended the warranty from 1 year to 3 for this particular problem.

A few months later I got a check in the post for £75 so can't really complain.

www.electronicsweekly.com/blogs/electronics-legislation/2007/11/leadfree-problems-for-the-xbox.html

[kittenyberk]

All of that stuff is noted.

New solder on the way, I know what I did with crap solder, so i'll fix it this week (hopefully, either that or kill it)

[kittenyberk]

Well, Bugger me.

It does sound better. Not (to my ears) a massive improvement, but just a bit more clearer. I think.

and oh god, I'd forgotten how awesome leady solder is.