6N1P tube ok in an V3?

[bennyboy]

Hi all, nice board. Anyone tried these tubes in the xCanV3?
if so, how did they sound? are they like the 6n23p?


Thanks, Benny.

[rickcr42]

Not likely.The heater current for the 6N1P is a very high 600 mA so i doubt the power supply is up to it

[bennyboy]

rickcr42 said:

Not likely.The heater current for the 6N1P is a very high 600 mA so i doubt the power supply is up to it

So is the power supply the only limit? if so I'm using 2500 ma supply. Will the tube just use what it needs? or is a part change it order ie; resistor?


Thanks, Benny.

[rickcr42]

So is the power supply the only limit? if so I'm using 2500 ma supply. Will the tube just use what it needs? or is a part change it order ie; resistor?

The heater supply is not the same as the B+ supply but is an entirely separate supply.You will need to add an external 6.3 V @ 750 mA just for the heater.Also,you need at least a 150 V B+ with 220-250 better if you want to get the sonics this tube is capable of.A lower voltage B+ is a waste of time (in my personal opinion)

What tube does the V3 use currently ? Is it a direct pin for pin drop in otherwise ?

[rickcr42]

you may find this helpful

www.fust-electronica.nl/ti6n1p_en.htm

[bennyboy]

rickcr42 said:

What tube does the V3 use currently ? Is it a direct pin for pin drop in otherwise ?

It comes stock with two NOS Philips 6922.

[bennyboy]

rickcr42 said:

you may find this helpful

www.fust-electronica.nl/ti6n1p_en.htm

Very helpful! Thanks.

[PinkFloyd]

I've been using 6n1p in the V2 / V3 for quite some time now without any problems at all and they actually sound bloody great, especially for the money. They are no good with the X-10D but with V2 / V3, very good indeed.

[bennyboy]

admin said:

I've been using 6n1p in the V2 / V3 for quite some time now without any problems at all and they actually sound bloody great, especially for the money. They are no good with the X-10D but with V2 / V3, very good indeed.

Thankyou Mike, I'll try some out soon! I get the tube just takes as much current as it needs?

With the higher current supply, it must help?


Benny.

[bennyboy]

admin said:

I've been using 6n1p in the V2 / V3 for quite some time now without any problems at all and they actually sound bloody great, especially for the money. They are no good with the X-10D but with V2 / V3, very good indeed.

Hey Mike, did they sound better than the 6n23 type tubes?


B

[rickcr42]

I've been using 6n1p in the V2 / V3 for quite some time now without any problems at all and they actually sound bloody great, especially for the money. They are no good with the X-10D but with V2 / V3, very good indeed

Would be interesting to know what you are getting as a heater voltage.When you draw current from a power source way above the ratings what you normally end up with is a voltage "sag",much like an AC Mains "brownout" in the peak summer air conditioning season (there is a limit though that like a brownout will cause a blown transformer ).

If so you are running the 6N1P in what is known as a "starved" condition,one that you just may have hit upon the perfect combination of ;D

Reference reading :

members.aol.com/sbench102/dht.html


this is entirely different from a "starved plate" voltage which generates distortion :

Almost as much the rage as tubed microphones are special preamps and so-called direct input boxes, which in studio signal chains serve to provide voltage gain, impedance conversion, and (in the case of direct input boxes) conversion from unbalanced to balanced connections. In spite of their lesser usage in studios, compared with tubed condenser microphones, these preamp devices are also riding high on a resurgence of popularity. Among the best-liked designs of this category are units that are solid-state but for a single 12AX7 tube operated at a very low plate voltage--as little as 12 V. This so-called starved-plate operation delivers high distortion, which some equipment designers consider the only useful characteristic of vacuum tubes in audio.

from this page :

www.milbert.com/articles/CoolSoundOfTubes/


sometimes you just get lucky which often is better than thinking you are good

[bassdude]

So... what was the conclusion?

Did you all determine it was safe to run the 6N1P's for extended periods in the XCAN v3?

I've got the XPSU v3 - does it provide enough power / current to safely drive the 6N1P's in the XCAN v3 without damage?

I've been running them for about a month, and they are outstanding in that amp - took the chance based on eveyone's prior suggestions that they seem to work OK.

The amp gets very slightly warm, but the XPSU stays at room temp.

I was concerned because I recently read - the damage to the transformer windings might take some time to develop.

[bennyboy]

I've tried just about every type I could get and they all sound good, some sound great!

I leave my Xcan on 24/7. It's been on since late july with no issues.

[bassdude]

OK... OK... OK...

The Musical Fidelity folks got back to me... and assured me the XPSU v3 provides more than enough current to meet the max current demands of the 6N1P - there should be "no problem" running the 6N1P in the XCAN v3 without risk of damage to it, or the XPSU v3.

They do sound great in it.

But, I'm not sure they really sound much better than the stock JAN Phillips 6922's, which have great bass, mids and highs, and good details, clarity, speed and soundstage. In fact, they sound an awful lot alike - the stock tubes and the 6N1P's.

[skydog]

Is standard XPSU that is supplied with X-can v3 amp is meant by MF folks to have enough current for 6N1P?

[PinkFloyd]

skydog said:

Is standard XPSU that is supplied with X-can v3 amp is meant by MF folks to have enough current for 6N1P?

It will work fine but it depends on how long it will remain working. You are really better using something >1,000mA if you plan on using the 6N1P and plan on leaving it switched on all the time. When you say "XPSU" that comes with the amp I take it you're referring to the wallwart and not the X-PSU itself? X-PSU v3 is fine with 6N1P.

Mike.

[skydog]

Mike,

First of all thanks for upgrade kit for X can v3 - after several weeks of caps upgrade everything is warmed up and sounds super especially with 6H1P EB tubes.
Comparing to 6H23P yes, Mike, you are right - the highs are with 'air' and bass is more concentrated.
And here please make it absolutely clear to me - if I use 6H1P tubes should I modify the xpsu that's comes in the box with X-Can v3? There's only a transformer inside (24-500mA). According to your recommendations the transformer should supply at least 1A current. That means it should be 24-1000mA, right? Will 30-1000mA be OK?

[medved]

Hey, guys (and gals?)! X-CANS V3 uses a center tapped power tranny (12-0-12). You can't just replace it with a regular 24volt unit. Instead get a good heater tranny with 4 of 6.3V secondaries (they should have the same current rating, and at least 2A each to make it worthwhile), and solder them in line, with a center tap (CT) in the middle:
-6.3 - 6.3 -CT- 6.3 - 6.3-
They should be connected in line only (not in parallel!!) and with their winding direction in mind -
start-end+start-end+CT+start-end+start-end
And it better be a good audio grade transformer (at least something like Hammond, the best - Tango or Tamura) - the power transformer has it's own voice as well as the power cable.
Trying various interconnects and speaker cables as power cords is useful for voicing the unit. I like Kimber PBJ (PSB bulk) with ferrite rings on it - from the transformer to the unit, and still lookin' for the best power cord from mains to the tranny. Right now it is VanDenHull M.C. D352 Hybrid.
And another tweak - I notice that transformers in audio electronics sound better when bolted to natural wood instead of metall chassis, or if it has a chassis, try resting it on wood (actual chassis structure should rest on it, not the feet/cones/etc.). Ayre Myrtle Blocks are a cheap try. However this tweak should be used with caution - some tubes and plastic caps are badly microphonic and benefit a lot from thorbothane and the like. Original JAN Philpses my X-CANS came with were BADLY microphonic, and got replaced with 1960's 6N23P (6N1P were OK too)