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Post by freddypipsqueek on Sept 21, 2012 23:01:44 GMT
I have recently picked up an HRT headstreamer which I though I'd use with my AT-ESW9s. The ESW9s sound dull (they are the only closed back headphones I have) to the point that I though they were fake. I have stripped them down for a rewire in case that helps (they seem original) but I am tempted by the following - the price seems acceptable. www.amazon.co.uk/AKG-K450BLU-K450-Headphones-Navy/dp/B001F6M5DI/ref=sr_1_19?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1348268121&sr=1-19I would appreciate some feedback or some alternative suggestions. I need a pair that I can put in a briefcase or bag for overnight use - Something that doesn't brake easily.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 8:03:03 GMT
Freddy, you've probably seen this as well, but I've seen reports of poor build quality. The plastic and the thin cable. Some have said that the connection to the earcups have failed and others have said that they sound 'muddy' and reckon that the change with time .... Also, beware of fakes. Apparently they're all over the place. Who knows Fine if you're just using them around the house, but I'm not so sure of putting it in a bag every day. They may be a bit fragile. Although they don't fold up as neatly, the hd25 is extremely good. In some ways I prefer it to the Beyer DT1350, although I think the Beyer is more like an 'accurate' sound. At the price of those AKG's though, nothing is that good really - I guess the Senn PX200 if you can get a seal. I don't suppose you want an IEM? Much easier for transporting around - the Senn CX300 www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B001EZYMF4/ref=asc_df_B001EZYMF49784999?smid=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&tag=googlecouk06-21&linkCode=asn&creative=22206&creativeASIN=B001EZYMF4and the CX400 come3 to mind. www.amazon.co.uk/Sennheiser-CX-400-II-Precision/dp/B001EZWO5O/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1348300760&sr=8-1I like both, but particularly the 400. They are both bass weighted though but are (for me) really enjoyable. The Senn cheap closed headphones are pretty plasticky. I don't particularly care for their slightly 'quacky' sound either, although I do know people who like them. One that I was impressed with was the HD202 and 201. www.amazon.co.uk/Sennheiser-HD-202-Closed-Headphone/dp/B003LPTAYI/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1348300886&sr=1-2However, still (as you can see - very plasticky) If you want an edgier more treble based sound, ins pite of my criticsms of them, they do have some real positives for people who like a clear top end - Sony V6 or (almost identical) the V7506. www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-MDR7506-MDR-7506-Headphones-Wired/dp/B000AJIF4E/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1348301169&sr=1-1-catcorrMy criticism of the Sony were the top end has a spike and there is a cut off up in the treble. However, if you get the volume set right for it (For me, that's critical with every headphone) and don't worry about numbers, it is a very good 'analytical' headphone. In fact, it could be used to mix with funnily enough. Mixes don't come out too shabby with them, so they are a pretty decent headphone. In fact, orchestral music really sounds 'correct' tonally with them which I find odd since some Pop/rock stuff can be toppy. (Could be the mixing though) Many wouldn't like the strong treble, while others love it!! I find it amazingly revealing for the price and it folds up into a bundle in a bag. Very tough too. For the price, they're good.
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Post by nonaim on Sept 22, 2012 11:47:08 GMT
I had a pair of these and they are well constructed,fold up quiet small and come with a nice hard travel case but I struggled with the comfort and sound quality. I could never get them to sit on my ears properly they kept slipping and the sound quality would suffer quiet badly. As for the sound quality there was a recessed feeling to it that I couldn't get used to other than that the sound quality was quiet good. As far as I know these weren't fakes I bought them open box from Superfi for about £40 a year or so ago. In the end I bought a pair of used ATws55i's much better comfort and better sound.
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 22, 2012 12:33:34 GMT
The Sen HD201 are superb sounding specially at the $16 USD specials that can be found a couple of times a year. The Samson SR850 (although larger) at under $35 USD is also a great deal. The Creative Live Aurvana at $90 USD is a bit more money but are smaller than the SR850 or the HD201 and sound a tad better, as they should considering their higher cost.
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Sept 22, 2012 12:34:30 GMT
I have owned two pairs (not concurrently) of the ATH-ESW9 and although lush sounding I found them to be very nice if a bit pricey.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 13:15:47 GMT
I'd love an esw9 but they're so expensive. The 10 even better!!
Sent from my iPod touch using ProBoards
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Post by freddypipsqueek on Sept 22, 2012 13:19:18 GMT
Interestingly I have just spent 3 hours rewiring the ESW9s. Used some mogami cable. They now sound a lot better. I think I have wired them inverted but as both channels are the same I plan to leave them - could this have explained the dull sound before ??. They have serious bass to them. Also I used a Viablue 3.5mm jack. What a poorly designed plug albeit when all was done it works and looks very neat.
I recall Mike would put bitumin tape on the inside of the wood on his ATs - Is this worth doing before I box then back up - the screws holding the wood on are poor (at least I now know its wood) and I think I will help them with a bit of epoxy.
Thanks for all the comments. I already have some PX200s but find them lightweight and I worry they will break. I am not a great fan of in ear units but the 400s look an interesting choice and I may well invest in those instead. I use the PX200s with an ipod when running and the 400s seem a good alternative. The AKGs appealed because of the hard case, fold-ability and price. They are also being sold by Superfi.
It a real shame about the number of fakes in the world. False tits are bad enough but headphones as well.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 14:05:22 GMT
;D Well, I guess they both use two cups. The es55 mentioned caught my eye. Trouble is the cost is virtually double. Good closed headphones are hard to come by, especially at this price. Not at this price, I really do like the Audio Technica ath-a900. One of the most comfortable closed headphones I've ever worn with a really nice sound quality. I wouldn't mind shortening the lead of this one to use as a portable headphone (not in public places though) since it has a low impedance and sounds so good. Just a bit too big to use on a bus though. Unless you really don't mind looking like a cyborg in public. Audio Technica make some really good headphones imo.
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Post by nonaim on Sept 22, 2012 16:48:02 GMT
I tried the AT es55's as well as the ws55i,both bought 2nd hand off eBay for about £80 ea I think, the es has a very "open" revealing sound for a closed HP but it had very little bass direct into a iPod it only sounded really bassey thru my neco portable amp and I was looking for a hp that works well plugged directly into an iPod so I went for the ws which isn't so revealing and open but has good bass also more comfort and an iPhone remote. I sometimes still wish I'd kept the es as it was the best portable hp I've heard but having to amp it to get decent bass was a pain.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 17:03:37 GMT
That's the same kind of thing I've found. There aren't many cheap closed headphones that are as good as I'd like. All a compromise.
The ie8 is decent if you can stand an iem. Mine are all custom fitted so it's not a problem for me.
I really like the a900 direct from an Ipod unamped. Trouble is that it's so big and the cable is too long. (I wish they'd fitted detachable cables) However, the sound is pretty balanced straight from an Ipod.
I also have the cheaper a500 which sounds good until you hear the a900!!
The a900 isn't the last word in high fidelity and all that, but a major step up from the other offerings for Ipods like Dre, Fanny Wangs, etc.
I've been using these Zoros recently. Pretty cheap and sound ok. Not brilliant but good for the price and extremely sensitive. Trouble is that the closed pad arrangement isn't great for a really good seal so noise creeps in pretty easily. Funny thing is that the seal isn't too critical for the bass. They sound fine.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 17:32:19 GMT
K450 graphs are saying: dark and boomy sounding with lost of resonances en.goldenears.net/8625It would not be on my to audition list. The ESW-9 and perhaps even the ES-55 would. I am quite confident they would not stand a chance to the DT1350 to my ears so never bothered.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 17:37:56 GMT
That's basically what I've been reading about them Frans, along with reliability problems. The only thing about the DT1350 is you have to be pretty serious about portable music at that price!! I guess at the lower end, I'd go Senn HD201/202.
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Post by freddypipsqueek on Sept 22, 2012 18:17:23 GMT
Frans - Thanks for the pointer on the K450.
Ian - Yes about the price and then the worry about losing them.
Frans - going back to Reply 6 - Is is possible that headphones will sound different is the polarity is reversed - I understood that is not important with speakers.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 18:54:46 GMT
Freddy, if you reverse the polarity of ONE side, there will be no bass. One speaker cancels out the other, but I'm not certain of the effects on a headphone.
When one ear is 'blowing' sound out the other is 'sucking' sound away so I imagine that will sound pretty odd in your head!!!
You certainly wouldn't get a focused bass in the centre (where it is normally).
I've never heard of one being wired incorrectly before.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 19:24:03 GMT
As Ian already replied if only one is reversed you get a strange stereo image. With speakers you would get little to no bass because of acoustical 'nulling' exactly between the speakers (not near the speakers themselves). With headphones you will still hear bass but 'strange' or 'different' than before. I have had this one or 2 times when modding HD681's as the wires were disconnected from the headband and accidentally swapped the wires when soldering back (one side has to be mirrored to get the phase correct). In these cases I could only tell it sounded 'quite different' and best noticed by voices not focussing properly in the middle of the head.
With respect to absolute phase.. a lot has been written about it and some people claim they can hear it but no one has ever proven that in lab conditions. My take on it is does absolute phase really exist in recordings ? How can one be sure all mics/instruments are recorded in the same phase (distance from instrument). How can one be sure the phase has never been turned 180 degrees in any of the equipment used ? I have experimented with a simple switch that reversed the polarity on both speakers at the same time long long ago (not using headphones as it requires balanced headphones) and personally could not tell any difference.
Theory is that when one taps on the bassdrum the membrane moves forward first. As said people have mentioned they could (clearly ?) discriminate. These are the absolute phase religion guys. But also as mentioned when tested under controled conditions they could not repeat it. The religion stayed ...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 20:02:06 GMT
Very rarely, Frans. Most people wouldn't be able to tell imo. I can't. Can you see mic men measuring the exact distances and ordering prima donna singers to keep absolutely still? I've never heard a headphone out of phase. It must sound very weird. I guess voices would kind of sound as though they're either coming from two places or just floating around without any kind of image. A bit scary. I had a recording on CD of Sting's Soul Cages and was playing it through some Mission speakers. I sat in the perfect triangle and on that particular CD, the engineers had done something with phasing (I think) in order to create a 3d effect from two speakers. The scary part was that I was sitting there focusing on the image and in one of the songs, there was a stray guitar ..... and I kid you not, it seemed to come from way beyond the left speaker and slightly behind me. The effect was so strong, that I actually jumped and turned around to see what it was before I realised that there was something funny going on. I'm not sure exactly what it was, but it almost sounded like it was 'out of phase' which placed it way out of the mix. I think it was also done with some kind of delay on the sound as well, but it was extremely eerie. Only ever heard that effect once on that album.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2012 21:47:18 GMT
Freddy, I wouldn't have thought changing both sides would change the sound of the headphone.
What amp are you using? I could be wrong, but there may be some DC floating around.
Is it the same with another amp?
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Post by freddypipsqueek on Sept 22, 2012 22:18:08 GMT
They are better with the 2 amps I have tried (my WNA3 and Ben Duncan).
It does sound odd.
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