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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2011 7:39:55 GMT
The 10 ohm resistor should be helping to minimise the effects of cable impedance as well.
I guessing that the proximity of the wires to each other do have an effect so if they' twisted, maybe this could alter the cable impedance? You've got me curious now Israel. Presumably, the cables come off and go on easily? ie: the plug quality of the new cable is ok? Also, hopefully, it's not possible to put them on with the connector the wrong way round? (So they're out of phase)
It looks quite a bit heavier than the original. Does it go over and stay on the ear as easily? You know, years back in the UK, twisted cables were quite poular for speakers.
I may give this a go although as you know, I'm not a cable person on headphones. I find it very hard to hear differences. However, at least the cable is a reasonable price and the guy isn't trying to rip us off like so many cable people seem to. (I hate that)
Ian
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2011 11:28:57 GMT
Ian, I am also guessing that the arrangement of the cable strands has a real audible effect on the cable impedance, perhaps more so than the material that the cable is made of, provided of course that it is a good conductor of electricity. Maybe this is why I like the Cardas cable so much. It is made of OFC copper but each strand is insulated from its neighbor, i.e. enameled as in transformer windings, and is also pleated in 'Litz" fashion, and shielded. Perhaps this is also why I like it much better than the Moon-Audio solid silver cable. All I know is that to my ears there is an audible difference between them. But, you started this as well by bringing up the question of impedance, Sooo.. you and I make each other think, which is a good thing! The Belkin gold plated plug on the upgrade cable from Hong Kong is superior to the original, which is not gold plated. The only advantage I see in this is that it will provide good contact for a longer period of time. The small plugs that connect to the drivers go only one way, similar to the original, so there is no danger of being out of phase, however one must be careful when removing from the ear not to pull the ie by the cable -- something I did once, and the cable came unplugged, unlike the original, which is notched, and takes a bit of gripping to pull from the driver. So, this is another possible shortcoming that I suggest you be aware of before you buy. If I see that I will stay with this cable, I may just discreetly put a tiny drop of removable hot glue in an invisible from the front spot to secure it better. So, for now, this is it on this cable -- warts and all. I hope you won't be disappointed. I myself am pleased with it -- warts and all! Cheers! Israel
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2011 15:31:14 GMT
Not 'arf Israel!! After an experiment with a cable on the Senn HD650, I felt robbed!!! I won't say what the lead was in case there are proud owners here, but ..... the plug wasn't even lined up with the cable and couldn't be straightened without taking it off. the connections easily pulled out of the headphones the connections were so long that I had to look straight ahead while listening or else they'd touch my shoulders. (I looked mental) The cable was just too heavy. The plug wasn't even a decent gold type. When I decided to lose it, I opened the plug up - hand soldered by an idiot!! Only cost about £175. After that, I was put off cables for life. If I'm honest, I couldn't hear a lot of difference in any case. However, you never know. If cable makers were a bit cheaper, we'd all be experimenting with it but these guys take the mick (Sorry Mick) and their prices seem just over the top. I think Mike on here bought a roll of that blue cable (I think that's Cardas) and he just solders them up himself. He stuck some of it on some headphones he was playing around with and sent a pair down to me. If they weren't so expensive, I'd experiment, but for the type of money that many ask, I can buy new headphones. However, these Chinese ones are cheap and look ok.... Ian
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elysion
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Post by elysion on May 29, 2011 16:50:18 GMT
I've ordered a lot of different pads and foam discs from thomann.de this morning, but also four original HD650 spare cables. It's my first order from thomann.de.
To buy online in Germany was quite expensive for me in the past, but at the moment the currency exchange ratios between Swiss Francs and Euros are almost ridiculous. Swiss Francs are very strong at the moment (also compared with the Pound Sterling) and that was also a reason why I've ordered Neco amps and parts from Mike in the last few months.
I'll use the HD650 cables also with the HD580's and HD560 OvII's. The cables are quite cheap and the increase in SQ is probably marginal, but I think it's a good replacement because it fits perfectly, is totally trouble free and it has a 6.3mm jack (instead of the 3.5mm jack of the HD560/HD580). The HD25-1/II and the HD414 (50th anniversary edition) could use the HD650 cables also.
The are really bad cables around, but mostly those are ultra-cheap cables and many of them are what manufacturers put as freebies into their product boxes.
I don't think we need to spend a lot of money to get fairly good cables.
I use mostly "Rock-Cables" which are made in China but have Neutrik plugs (it's the cheap cable product line of Neutrik). Bargain price but very good results/quality.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2011 18:06:35 GMT
I agree that some of these cables, especially the ones that are made by inept 'entrepreneurs' are indeed a rip-off. Since I buy the Cardas cable by the foot at about $7.00 a foot or so, it costs me about $70 USD to make a 5 ft. cable, which includes the Cardas rhodium-plated driver connectors, a Cardas rhodium-plated 6.3mm stereo plug, and misc. items such as solder, shrink wrap tubing, etc.,. And I know it is done right -- I check all the connections carefully with my ohm-meter. I have made six of them so far. The only time I paid $200 for a cable was for the Moon-Audio silver cable with its slightly improved highs, which I got rid of because after a while, especially after making a Cardas cable, I ended up disliking. My thinking is that I already have more headphones than I can ever use, and improving what I have by adding a $70 cable for me is better than just buying another piece of equipment. Of course, I also tend to do this as well, but IMHO $70 for a good cable is not that much to spend on improving the sound of one set of headphones, which sometimes cost between $300 and $400 USD or more. Even my cheaper headpohes such as the Senns HD-25-1 II, and the modded Superlux ones have, to my ears, benefited from the cable upgrade. As I said earlier, I am beginning to wonder whether it is the construction of a cable, i.e. the pleating of the strands, and shielding (or lack thereof), affecting the cable impedance that make the audible difference more than the material used.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2011 18:11:18 GMT
Hi Christian. I do agree with you about cables. The little Lark amps from China and the Guanzo are sent out with an rca lead. I don't think they're particularly expensive but they're quite adequate for the job.
Some of the Senn alternative leads are just ridiculous prices. Cardas seems one of the lower priced better leads but still too dear for me to be bothered. I'd rather buy another K601 and would have change to spare.
Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 29, 2011 20:32:53 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2011 21:19:40 GMT
OK Mike. Many thanks. Can I be cheeky and ask for a fuse to put in the old Little Pinkie? I blew it again!!!! Don't ask. ) I've sent you a pressie to thank you (and make you smile) but you may not fully appreciate it ...... Well, you do seem to be a 'Night Night person.' 'You liked the song so much I bought the company.' (The songs that go with it!!) I agree about those bloody keys to open up. Do you still need an email with the rude header for my address? (Something about a slow bar stuard? ) No .... I know you're up to your neck in an upside down house and lots of macho men for company!! Mike, are you still using portable stuff or have you given up? I have a klipsch you're welcome to if you want it. You may find it a better fit. I know you have problems with them but if you went to an 'ear' place, you could have a custom mould made if you use Ipods mobile. Anyway, if you're interested in trying one, I could send one up for you. Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 29, 2011 22:14:09 GMT
Ian, I'll slice your jiffy bag open and throw in a few fuses... no probs at all. You know me, I am not a portable type of person.... I could EASILY say "yeh, send me up those headphones" but I'm not like that mate..... I have ZERO use for portable headphones.... I am a pretty stationary animal and when I "do" go out I like interacting with other people.... I actually get a nice buzz from talking to people and (I'd like to think) they get a nice buzz from me... we call it the "crack" up here..... I can listen to recorded music anytime, the "crack" is LIVE and, thus, constantly evolving and always NEW. So, my friend, thanks for the offer but I will decline on this occasion.... your "surprise" package, on the other hand, sounds enticing All the best, Mike.
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 29, 2011 22:57:10 GMT
Send your Neco up to me and I'll fit it it with flush mounted "philips" screws.... I'll also do the 10 0hm "thang" so you can charge that 500mAh puppy overnight..... You know you are my favourite Ian ..... I like you the best
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 29, 2011 23:28:00 GMT
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on May 30, 2011 12:26:07 GMT
For those of you using this amp on the go have you considered using a low profile LOD with your iPod's? It would reduce the overall length by about an inch and you would not risk damaging the cable nor the plug.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2011 13:25:30 GMT
I'm such a tart!! Your Neco keeps changing its knob!! Mike, I have the new Neco with a large battery and fast charge so don't need it altered!! I can't run the bloody battery out to be honest!! Quite amazing. The old one sits charging for a day and I take it as a quick replacement but I never seem to run out..... I run it in the bedroom so it's not a big deal to leave it charging. The old one also has the 8610's in it so I have a comparison amp. I'll send the Ape up though if that's ok with you. I blew it up. (With a Little Pinkie) (a diode?) I'll Paypal your time up!!! I know .... I'm a nutter. Next time, I'll check the lead and what it's connected to. For those of you using this amp on the go have you considered using a low profile LOD with your iPod's? It would reduce the overall length by about an inch and you would not risk damaging the cable nor the plug.I've never seen one Miguel. Where do you get them? Ian
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2011 15:32:41 GMT
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Post by JohnnyBlue on May 30, 2011 16:11:54 GMT
I bought one of these for my wife's iPhone: it only lasted about half-a-dozen plugging-ins/pulling-outs before it packed up altogether... (and you can stop sniggering at the back, there).
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2011 16:50:47 GMT
Actually, I'm wondering whether Miguel means a low profile dock connector with the lead going at right angles into the side of the connector. If that's what he means, I could use one. I really must get some decent leads for my Ipods actually. I'm such a cheapskate with leads. You know, I have loads of these things: www.amazon.co.uk/Logic-iPod-Retractable-Audio-Cable/dp/B000JS38FM/ref=sr_1_32?ie=UTF8&qid=1306773959&sr=8-32However, I only paid about £3:00 for them and I broke off the round lead holder since I found that if you retracted the lead, it broke after a short while since there's only about one strand of copper in there!!! The handy thing is that they are a couple of feet long so I can use them in my car but rock bottom quality!!! I just chuck them away and replace them. I also have the little Fiio leads but they're about 5 inches long which can be a pain. I'll go mad one day and get a posh short, medium and long lead with two types of connectors - RCA and 3.5 jacks. So that's 6 leads at, probably £25 each? £150. Sod it!! Apple are so precious about that stupid connector. I might even get a soldering iron one day (when the wife's not watching 'cos she hates mess) and do it myself with a piece of electrical wire!!! I'd rather buy another K601. Ian the cheapo.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2011 18:15:34 GMT
I bought one of these for my wife's iPhone: it only lasted about half-a-dozen plugging-ins/pulling-outs before it packed up altogether... (and you can stop sniggering at the back, there). Sorry to hear about your experience with this. I have used one of these for about two years now, and it has never failed me so far. Perhaps you got a bad one? (And, yes, I agree -- no sniggering at the back allowed!!! )
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2011 18:18:28 GMT
Well I don't think anyone laughed at me for blowing up my Mini Ape with the wrong power lead. Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 30, 2011 22:20:01 GMT
I'm such a tart!! Your Neco keeps changing its knob!! Mike, I have the new Neco with a large battery and fast charge so don't need it altered!! I can't run the bloody battery out to be honest!! Quite amazing. The old one sits charging for a day and I take it as a quick replacement but I never seem to run out..... I run it in the bedroom so it's not a big deal to leave it charging. The old one also has the 8610's in it so I have a comparison amp. I'll send the Ape up though if that's ok with you. I blew it up. (With a Little Pinkie) (a diode?) I'll Paypal your time up!!! I know .... I'm a nutter. Next time, I'll check the lead and what it's connected to. I'll have a look at it Ian... hopefully it will be something simple, don't worry I'll fix it Your feet and fuses will ship tomorrow.... fit the feet as shown (front and back): They are very stable in this position and adhere the best here..... there will be no "migration" with them in this position.... the rest of the enclosure is "stepped" so it's not really suitable to fit them on the stepped "outer" edges..... trust me, fit them as shown and you won't have any probs Take care when removing the OPA227.... your best bet is to lever them up slowly with a small flat blade screwdriver and then "grab" them with a pair of long nosed pliers and gently ease them out of the sockets.... they are not in the ideal position for "rolling" but, with a bit of care, you'll get them out without bending the legs.... no probs. As previously suggested..... give the OPA228 a good few hours to "burn in", the sonics will expand / fill out after a couple of days of use.... should sound pretty awesome from cold tho' Mike.
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2011 7:23:01 GMT
Thanks Mike. I'd given up with it and put my embarrassment away!! I must label up the leads.
I can see why you went for the long rubber strips with the steps but that looks fine. I's not a big deal. I've had it sitting on a hardish piece of foam and it's been fine. It runs SO cool.
I know what you mean about getting op amps in and out!! I do a kind of 'shifty' thing on either side of the op amp with a minute flat screwdriver, going from one side to the other, gradually levering it out until it pops up into the air.
I use one Neco as a 'reference' to any changes.
Israel, another useful device for the Ipods if you use them is the Fiio E1. Very cheap amplifier that takes its power from the Ipod or Iphone and acts as a remote control.
You just plug it in to the dock connector and plug the iems in. More power and easy track access. It works well with the ie8 - no hiss. Provides enough power and is extremely cheap.
Fiio provides some really good value cheap end stuff.
Ian
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2011 15:12:02 GMT
Israel, another useful device for the Ipods if you use them is the Fiio E1. Very cheap amplifier that takes its power from the Ipod or Iphone and acts as a remote control. You just plug it in to the dock connector and plug the iems in. More power and easy track access. It works well with the ie8 - no hiss. Provides enough power and is extremely cheap. Fiio provides some really good value cheap end stuff. Thanks for the suggestion, Ian! A couple of weeks ago I bought a Fiio 5 from Amazon, and had to send it back -- sound kept breaking up. Must have gotten a bad one. I may try my luck again with the Fiio 1. From what I saw in the description and photo at Amazon, it looks interesting. Cheers! Israel
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2011 15:29:28 GMT
Sorry to hear that Israel. The E5 has a little more power than the E1 but there is no battery to charge in the E1. I can use the E1 with the AKG k601 straight out of the Ipod. It's not ideal, but useful for odd moments of podcasts. It is making a bit more current available to the ie8 though as well without having a box (like the Neco) attached.
Because they're so cheap, it's most likely the Earphone socket playing up? (They're not the best)
I've found them all pretty good though funnily enough and the guy that makes them is very keen on listening to users and making amps that suit them!! His e11 looks interesting and is also very cheap. I'll have one of those in a couple of weeks to listen to. Looking forward to that.
They're cheap things but it makes you not worry too much about them when you're out and about. I use both E1 and E5 quite a lot moving around and Neco at home in the kitchen/bedroom or where ever around the house.
I also use some V-Jays headphones which have a split in the middle so you can shorten the lead to just over one foot and connect into the E1. I'm thinking about trying the C-Jays because I'm also quite keen on the V-Jays for Rock/pop based stuff. They're not analytical enough for good orchestral listening, but the C-Jay may be better for that. Or the good old Portapro works very well.
The thing is that this kind of stuff is so cheap so you don't worry so much about it when you're out and about.
The V-Jays and Portapros are kind of the same 'category' of headphone and I'm torn between the two. I think the Portapros do the top a bit better and the V-Jays have this 'clattery' type sound which works rather well with rock stuff. Portas sound a bit more extended up top.
All work rather well from the E1 and E5. (Talk about cheap listening?)
Ian
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Z
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Post by Z on May 31, 2011 20:14:18 GMT
how's it compare to the pa2v2? and does it get hot? i was thinking the op amps got hot so he jacked them up a bit to give them some air/space... and then a heavy all aluminum enclosure. it just looks like this thing gets hot.
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 31, 2011 20:29:58 GMT
how's it compare to the pa2v2? and does it get hot? i was thinking the op amps got hot so he jacked them up a bit to give them some air/space... and then a heavy all aluminum enclosure. it just looks like this thing gets hot. Colt, the V2 portable runs totally COLD.... no heat at all.... if there was heat then NO WAY would you get such an insane playtime from one charge. I believe the reason the Neco is solid aluminium is more a "ruggedness" type of thing than anything to do with heat dissipation...... you could, literally, drop this thing from the top of Blackpool tower and it would still play.... try doing that trick with something like a "voyager".... it would be it's LAST voyage before it smashed to smithereens all over the pavement Nope, built like a brick shite house and built to last.... that's what I like about it.... if you want something the size of a Zippo lighter that will snap in half, if you so much as fart on it, then go down the ibasso route.... if you want something which will last and will survive a sledgehammer attack then go the NECO route. Of the three I just mentioned (ibasso, Neco, Voyager) the Neco has the nicest sound (to my ears) followed closely by the ibasso and then the Voyager.... it is, BY FAR, the best value of the three... no doubt at all. Mike.
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 31, 2011 20:44:38 GMT
BTW.... I bought ten of these cables (Dock to 3.5mm) they were about £10 each... All gone now but I will try to find the supplier again.... thing is, nowadays.... you see something for sale one minute and the next it has disappeared (along with the seller).... they are bloody good leads (very well made) and I'll do my best to find the supplier. Mike.
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