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Post by gover1 on Apr 26, 2006 16:06:01 GMT
hi, have read a lot on this forum about different dac projects, im looking for a way of substantially improving my source (currently got a nad t550 dvd player) so am looking for either usb or sp/dif dac, am looking for something where i can buy the printed circuit board and add components, or can buy a pre packaged kit that i just need to assemble, the main considerations would be value and sound quality. i would be very greatfull if people could suggest anything. i know there are some very knowledgable people on this forum, so i thought this might be a good place to look for help p.s just did the xcan v2 upgrade was unsure at first of the results, but after a days burn-in i am very impressed.
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rickcr42
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Rest in peace my good friend.
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 26, 2006 16:19:11 GMT
Price range ? Oversampling or Non OS DAC ? As for a USB DAC as far as I know not usable with a DVD player unless yours has a USB output. in a "traditional" DAC,that is one with oversampling you have the K&K Audio kit : www.kandkaudio.com/digitalaudio.htmland the Hagerman board DAC which is an assembled module : www.hagtech.com/hagdac.htmlboth solid no nonsense designs tough to beat with a stick.The K&K has a boatload of output options and the Hagerman is upgradable to the Chime USB DAC which adds a tube output stage and USB interface plus an option for the Hag Clock : www.hagtech.com/chime.htmlin the Non-Oversampling category is the Monica 2 : www.diyparadise.com/dackit/1545bdackit.htmland the Scott Nixon DAC : www.scott-nixon.com/dac.htmthe Nixon DAC is another that can be brought up to USB specs and have a tubed output stage option. all the above are "known" kits that have a history of both successful builds and satisfaction in system which is always a plus over the more unknown that may be a bargain or may be crap.Mainstream has it plusses and the body of content on the internet-reviews,build sites,the "look what i built" type sites and forum conversations means if you run into any problems someone somewhere will have an answer for you so it is my recommendation to go that route rickmonster
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Post by gover1 on Apr 26, 2006 18:51:54 GMT
hi, thanks for the quick reply, i am currently quite attracted to the monica2 however i would want to use this both with a xcanv2 and a quad 306 + passive pre. i know this dac likes an input impedance of 20k so would this be suitable/ would it be worth considering making this : diyparadise.com/mar06/gg.html (its well out of my league, but maybe i could pay someone to make it for me) or maybe an x-10d? these are all just suggestions, see what you think, thanks, mark p.s looking for less than £100 initial spend, but like the idea of future upgrades if go for usb will be from computer not dvd
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rickcr42
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Rest in peace my good friend.
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 26, 2006 19:24:39 GMT
I know the Quad amp has a very high input sensetivity,something just below 400mv and I beleive the X-Cans V-2 also has a very high input sensitivity so the output voltage of the DAC should be more than enough and if not you can avoid the expense of a triode stage and use a 10:1 microphone step up transformer to make up the additional gain.
If you DO build something along the lines of that posted above you need to know it will expensive fast (power supply mostly),the chassis work can be a real bitch and the voltages are lethal so you need to have some good DIY skills and pay attention at all times
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rickcr42
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Rest in peace my good friend.
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 26, 2006 20:04:28 GMT
BTW-this is essential reading for anyone considering doing a triode DAC output stage but turn on your popup blockers folks ! www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/xentar/1179/theory/vasfda/vasfda.htmlThis site is brutal on the popups ! The content is worth it even if not so if you have no blockers I suggest : A-you bounce over to google and install the Explorer Search Bar plug-in which has a good one (along with a right click a page anywhere translator) B-if you want to look at an expanded jpeg or gif file do not left click but right click and "open in new window" or you will be sorry when you hit the back button
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Post by gover1 on Apr 27, 2006 17:05:56 GMT
hiya, ok im definetly going to give the monica 2 dac kit a go, so heres the next question, im trying to get my hifi ready for taking to uni, so a one box solution would be best, i am thinking of putting a monica 2 , an xcan v2, a cross feed unit, and possibly a good diy phono stage if i can find one + a source selector all into one box, with a seperate box for all the transformers and power supplies. would there be any sonic or thermal disadvantage to doing this and can anyone recomend any good cases? thanks for any help, mark
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rickcr42
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Rest in peace my good friend.
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 27, 2006 17:27:39 GMT
So what you are making is a good old fashioned Full function Preamplifier Having all the anolog on a single box is easy.adding in the digital can be a bit tricky since you will have a HUGE RF generator in the same box with something having a gain of X100 or better so consider as much distance as you can get between the two,add applicable RFI bypass caps/inductors right at the power supply entry to each active device. Not the board supply entry point but the actual as close to the opamp/transistor/tube as you can get them then if possible use a grounded shield between the analog and digital sections,maybe even a "box within a box" using a cast aluminum box for the Monica which is then placed within the overall chassis. I can give recommendations all day and into the night but it would be better if you could give some "hint" what style type you are into. for something with a bit of style over the commonly available- www.iagaudio.com/
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Post by gover1 on Apr 27, 2006 17:51:15 GMT
hi sounds good would i still need the rfi bypass caps if they were all powered by seperate power supplies? have not quite decided whether to go down this route or to go for the route of several uniform boxes, (all small square aprox equivelent to the x v3 series from musical firdelity. had looked at the galaxy enclosures from audiokit.it ( badly designed website but great prices) either for a one box or multi box option, but am unsure about theire ability to deal with the heat( would also like this project to deal with the overheat issue it looks like im having with my xcan v2). also any ideas of a good diy turntable pre amp kit of simillar value to the monica 2 dac thats worth building, sorry if i sound all questions, but im just trying to find whats available out there, and planning on a budget, thanks for your help, particularly yours rick, mark
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rickcr42
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Rest in peace my good friend.
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 27, 2006 19:10:23 GMT
I am a firm beleiver in protecting ALL signal entry points from any external infleunces so what you end up with is the sound of the actual device uncolored. The "all" includes input and output connections and every single power supply entry to active devices because truth is a power supply IS the signal and if contaminated no amount of jack filteris will help. The bad news is if the device in question uses a pcb or is a commercial product there is usually limited possibilities for weasle-ing in more parts.The good news is the parts are dirt cheap and if there is room on board (I also out of years old habit toss an 0.1uf cap across every single input jack ) Weeeeellllllll............ I realise most folks like to look at their audio equipment but to be honest about the best choice for both a solid state phone stage and a basic DAC with no actual controls is a simple cast aluminum box like the Hammonds : www.hammondmfg.com/dwg.htmyou end up with a "put it anywhere" module that need not be ugly but is pure function.I shoot mine with either silver or gold "hammerite" paint then bake them in a toaster oven at 250F for a couple of hours for durability.an added bonus is if they are all the same basic size stacking is a snap. because of the heat issue with all things tube or class-a solid state (all I use) I like to go the open frame route but that is not always an option for a retro-fit of a commercial product. The problem with enclosed cases that already have vents is they all vent to the sides but as we all know heat rises so while helpful not the ideal. Buying an off the shelf "fully enclosed" chassis and trying to add your own vents can drive a normal person to insanity and we mostly being not the most sane persons to begin with (DIY audio geeks ) more likely to throw ourselves off a cliff or throw shit out the window than the average human if things go wrong. BUT ! The Rickmonster has over time even whipped this problem in a manner that is not too butt ugly,is cheaper than any other alternative method I have yet found and allows for serious ventilation.Taht is a simple aluminum chassis such as these : but instead of using the "stock" bottom cover panels : I "flip" the chassis so the bottom becomes the top and then screw on this type of top : or this type : For large raw material quantities this is an excellant source www.mcmaster.com/but the reason for the selected perforations is they are available every damn where from building supplies to hardware stores and with a bit of local searching no doubt there is something similiar available. I recently did a custom EL-84 PP amp for a guy that wanted to go away from the "classic" chassis/cage type housing but still wanted the tubes enclosed while keeping down the cost. Normally enclosed would mean build on a chassis,add a rack panel to the front (with side braces !) then pop the whole thing either into a rack or a custom harwood cabinet with top venting but this was a budget build so I used the above method using two chassis bolted "top to top" (the large panel area) so i could mount the tubes on top of the chassis while STILL having the tubes inside a chassis (plus having all parts under the first as in a typical tube amp build),shot the whole thing with charcoal hammerrite paint,cut the top piece then painted it with gold hammer paint,added and oak front panel which i then stained with min-wax Red Oak stain,five coats of satin polyurethane and the whole shootin' match came in at $50 !!! Looked damn good too.i may even make myself an identical amp just because
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Post by gover1 on Apr 27, 2006 19:29:11 GMT
hi, thanks again rick for another brilliant bit of help think ive got the plan all sorted
1.build monica2 dac into a hammond enclosure (ask ric for more help / details as where these extra cpacitors should go (electrical abilities go as far as following guides) 2. find a phono pre amp stage and build in a hamond 3. rehouse the xdac ino an aluminium enclosure, with the perforated top (top idea that how robust is it ( for taking to and from uni)) 4. mount hamond enclosures into same aluminium case as the xdac v2 , therfore being an all in one box solution that i have only had to pay for bit by bit (work voluntary and live in middle of no where so all parts will need to be ordered on the net) thanks for the help rick, presume u got no ideas on the phono stage? , mark
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 27, 2006 19:36:03 GMT
Is that your hand Rick?
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rickcr42
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Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 27, 2006 19:49:07 GMT
BZZZZZZZZZT ! Wrong answer www.hagtech.com/bugle.htmlmaybe the best bang for the buck "kit" type phono pre out there though me being a "valve" type i would shoot for this puppy ; www.hagtech.com/cornet2.htmlI would buy the pcb for the $99 then choose my own parts and housing.Maybe a future 'upgrade" ? You kiddin ? Who is that woman masquerading as a man ? not NEARLY enough scars,not beat up enough,nails too long,nails too damn CLEAN ! I am nothing but a hands on down and dirty type and my hands pretty much tell my life story,even the tatoo on my left middle finger of a cross that has been there since the age of twelve
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Post by gover1 on Apr 27, 2006 20:11:51 GMT
hi, fantastic idea, but way out of my price range at the minute. think i might give the bugle phono + power supply a go though the reviews all seem very favourable. now just to try and sell my ps2 to get the money to do all of this, figure id be best building the phono stage and dac at the same time due to ordering the relevent parts in the correct numbers, oooh i can feel my soldering iron getting warm already, cant wait just got to get a bit of cash now :-)
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 30, 2006 20:41:52 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 30, 2006 21:27:10 GMT
[even the tatoo on my left middle finger of a cross that has been there since the age of twelve I had you down for more of a satan tattooed on your bell end type of guy Rick BTW, my hands are as smooth as a babies arse cause I use MILD GREEN FAIRY LIQUID ;D <singing>For hands that do dishes that feel as soft as your face, mild green fairy liquid</singing>
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rickcr42
Fully Modded
Rest in peace my good friend.
Posts: 4,514
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Post by rickcr42 on Apr 30, 2006 21:43:26 GMT
at 12 years old ? I would throw my dishes out the window unwashed then shoot at them with a rifle rather than dip my hands in anything called "Fairy Liquid" ! Now "beans" is another matter ;D
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