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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 1, 2013 20:01:54 GMT
Musical Fidelity X-PRE rejuvenation I was going to call this thread "X-PRE modifications" but decided just to call it Musical Fidelity X-PRE rejuvenation instead because, basically, that is all that has taken place apart from a few little "tweaks" here and there. Musical Fidelity X-PRE upgrade / tweaks / mods / improvements / power supply / renovation / spare parts / valves / tubes was too long a title  This little puppy arrived the other day and was in a pretty bad way with two knackered valves and some of the caps gone high ESR. The worst affected caps were those adjacent to the power resistor and the regulators..... these are "hot spots" in the X-PRE and the stock Jamicon, general purpose, 85C caps just weren't up for prolonged "duty" next to heat. The X-PRE is essentially a combination of an X-CANS and an X-10D all crammed into the one "Can"..... there's very limited space so very hard to fit extra capacitance but I managed to squeeze a tiny bit extra in ..... having worked on both the X-10D and the X-CANS I soon found the familiar sweet spots and went ahead and fitted my standard "mods"....... That was the easy part, the hardest part was deliberating on whether or not to replace the Quad Motorola MC33079P opamp with something more modern like the OPA404KP or OPA4134.... well, I have been the entire DAY swapping out between the three and the stock MC33079P hits the spot, each and every time. The OPA404KP and OPA4134 sounded great BUT there was a sense of "tube less" with them on board..... it was a highly accurate, almost clinical, presentation with the OPA404KP but that wonderful "glow" to the sound, the mellifluous flow and the "tubyness", which was apparent with the old Motorola MC33079P Quad opamp, went right out the window so I decided to stick with the stock Motorola MC33079P..... especially as my customer said he liked the "valve sound"..... No point in wasting money fitting a new, all singing all dancing, opamp if it totally destroys the signature sound of the preamp. Next ear consuming job was a shoot out between the JAN Philips 6922 and the Russian 6N23P-EB (I was confident the 6N23P-EB would sound best)..... Turns out the 6922 (in this application) was streets ahead of the 6N23P-EB in every respect..... customer will be VERY happy as he has already saved money on a new "modern" opamp and a more expensive pair of valves Anyhoo, I'm not going to sit here all night typing and will simply say..... from what I heard when it arrived and what I hear now is not a "night and day" improvement, it's a fekkin' MIRACLE..... total improvement! Not a subtle improvement either, a major one! Basically, here's what I did: Bottom board:C109 / C209 - Replaced the stock 10uF / 50V electrolytics with 10uF / 16V non polar Nichicon MUSE (these are the input coupling caps and can even be removed / jumpered over if there is no DC from the source output) C206 / C106 / C105 / C205 were all replaced with Panasonic FC 10uF / 50V C10 / C9 (1000uF / 16V) were replaced with high temp. 135C Samwha VA series 2200uF /16V C4 / C8 were replaced with panasonic NHG / 105C / 1000uF / 35V C104 / C204 (2.2uF) were replaced with 4.7uF metallised film caps. C102 / C101 / C202 /C201 (220nF) were all replaced with WIMA MKS4 / 1uF / 100V film caps C15 (which was missing from the board!) had a WIMA MKS4 / 1uF / 100V film cap fitted into position. Top Board:C1 / C5 (470uF) were replaced with Panasonic NHG / 105C / 1000uF / 35V C2 / C6 (1000uF) were replaced with Panasonic FC / 105C / 1500uF / 35V C3 / C7 (1000uF) were replaced with Panasonic NHG / 105C / 1000uF / 35V C11 / C12 (100uF) were replaced with high temp. 135C Samwha VA series 100uF / 35V ALL Diodes (D1 / D2 / D3 / D4 / D5 / D6) were replaced with ultrafast UF4001 types. R10 was removed and replaced with a 5K1 resistor to tone down my stock "purple LED" Ceramic valve bases were fitted. A brand new pair of hand matched (on tube imp) JAN Philips 6922 fitted A new quad phono block was fitted. Both boards fully cleaned...... Now on test for 48 hours. These are my "notes" guys so please don't delete this thread I've got them down on paper but, knowing me, that will disappear within a few hours...... I'm terrible when it comes to "keeping" sight of paperwork. Last but not least...... the under bonnet pRON  I hope this thread is of help to Musical Fidelity X-PRE owners who want to bring their X-PRE's back to life (TURBO!) and it is a free tutorial. I will not be supplying a kit but can provide you with the correct parts you require if you ask me nicely  Pinkie                |
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mrarroyo
Been here a while! 
Our man in Miami!
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Post by mrarroyo on Oct 2, 2013 9:50:27 GMT
Nice work as usual Mike.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2013 19:30:35 GMT
Thanks Miguel Very "tight" work in this case, there's not a lot of available space to work with..... I did my best and trust Rob will comment as soon as his X-PRE arrives back in The Netherlands..... (posted today Rob)...... It was fun working on it and the end result brought a BIG smile to my ears, so much so I am actually going to buy one...... I have always been an "integrated" man myself but this X-PRE (tubed) connected to a few of my "power amp capable" amps really did get my ears twitching with desire for "more" of the same  Pink Floyd, PULSE, without the X-PRE sounded decent..... with the X-PRE inline it sounded amazing! You could almost "pinpoint" the tubes that Gilmour had in his guitar amps...... just sounded more REAL with the X-PRE as preamp.... fascinating! |
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2013 19:45:59 GMT
The "twisting" of the red and black also helps As stock it is not twisted......... twist it for best effect Mike. Twist and shout! A SIMPLE "mod" that brings many new members of the band closer to your ears |
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 16, 2013 19:28:09 GMT
I'm happy to mod these for customers but will not be providing a kit as it's a bit of a shoe horning job and would rather insist on doing it myself than have customers e-mailing me back saying the parts didn't fit It's not "cheap", nothing is these days, but I would rather perform the mods myself. All of my work comes with a 2 year warranty as standard but should last a lifetime. Mike. |
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Post by delarobbie on Nov 11, 2013 13:09:24 GMT
hi there, i'm the happy owner of the rejuvenated X-PRE. i bought it second hand on the internet
i use it in combination with a technics sl1200--> cambridge 540P[modded] pre --> X-PRE --> Trends TA-10.2 --> Spendor SP2/2 speakers. all connected
with proper interlinks of course. the sound is nice, it has an analogue warmth, and lots of detail. I'm not much of an technician, i've got a technical friend who
put it together for me, but using the X-PRE was my idea: i wanted some tubes in the setup, i'm a guitarist and always use Fender tube-amps.
we were surprised how detailed & natural the sound was, the only thing i missed was a little more low, for that we put in a Jamo subwoofer,
now its complete: i can mix in lots of bass, if i like [the neighbours don't like it...]
Don't think i will ever change it, i'm happy with the the sound, but after a few months the sound became a little distorted.., since i bought the X-PRE on the internet
i did not know how many hours the tubes had been playing, so i decided that it needed a new pair, then i found Mike on the net, it was clear to me that he was the
man i needed. when i read his notes the X-PRE really needed a serious operation, and i'm happy that he upgraded it like he did, changing almost all components.
the purple eye is on it and its even got a british flag on it, i'll never have to open it again, well maybe to change the tubes every now and then.
Now the verdict, i was real happy with the sound, wasn't used to decent sound, i had a crappy old record player on a very old hifi-amp, so this setup really opened up
my ears, and i've been using it for a few months playing LP records for a few hours every evening after work, what did change after the X-PRE has been operated..? well it has the
same nice sound it had before but i think it's got even better, nice non distorted highs, detailed, a sound i can listen to an evening long, and since it's not been played in, the sound
is gonna open up even more, it became a little microphonic, but i put it on foam and won't be tapping it during play, so thats no problem.
so what else can i say but: mission accomplished, and.. thanks Mike !
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2013 20:28:49 GMT
delarobbie
There is no doubt that Mike can wring the very best out of these MF products, as well as markedly extend their service life by replacing 85c rated electrolytic capacitors with higher temperature capacitors and other measures.
Regards
Alex
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Post by PinkFloyd on Nov 13, 2013 8:54:58 GMT
Hey Rob, Glad you are enjoying it I will send you over a pair of Russian valves which will not be microphonic, the Philips 6922 can sometimes be microphonic.... more so than most of the E88CC / 6922 valves.... as you say, it's fine unless you tap the enclosure but I would prefer non microphonic valves myself.... remind me of your address (via e-mail) and I'll pop a pair of really nice 6N23P into the post. Just hold onto the 6922 and let us know how the 6N23P sound in the X-PRE. Mike. |
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Post by mattn on Nov 18, 2013 19:43:24 GMT
Mike – about time I wrote a review of my X-Pre after you carried out the mods. Wow – what a transformation, this thing’s in a completely different league now & sounding considerably better than it ever did.
I’ve been using a passive pre amp for quite some time, on and off with a MF fine-tuned X-10D valve buffer (but that’s another painful story you are aware of) and been reasonable happyish. Whilst my passive pre-amp is truly excellent in data retrieval, sadly it can sound cold and uninspiring with a lack of bass clout and fullness. I understand this is not uncommon of passives & Hi Fi is all a game of compromises I guess to a degree, whatever your tastes are.
When I read about your work on an X-Pre, I thought this was the time to get it out of the cupboard, dust off its cobwebs and let you have a play with it and get it back in my rig. I’m using a silent media centre PC, SOTM sound card, linear PSU running J River 19 Media Centre feeding, via USB, a modded Audiolab MDAC with the pre-amp linked to a Chord power amp & Wilmslow Audio Mercury speakers.
Mike, I can’t thank you enough, it’s miles better than it ever was in standard fettle. I now have a system which has a wonderful valve warmth, a great body and projection and a soundscape that feels just right. Instruments are clearly delineated and everything is in the right proportion. Bass is back, it’s full, it’s clear and so much more enjoyable. The mid-band has that great valve spotlight without over emphasis & the whole thing is just a gem to listen to. Great work Mike, you’ve made a true giant killer out of a budget piece of kit, really great work
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Post by PinkFloyd on Nov 23, 2013 21:04:17 GMT
Hi Matt, Just got round to reading this, I am glad you are liking it I've had a couple of deaths in my family (not me, obviously) so have been off the radar for a few days travelling about the country meeting up with people I have nothing in common with, listening to all that shite about "god" (who has taken the deceased to a better place) and having to endure cringifying moments without doing a projectile Wallace (wallace and Grommit = vomit)..... Since "WHEN" has it become trendy for "family" to do turns at a funeral? My deceased Auntie's granddaughter did a 20 MINUTE long rendition (in song) from her favourite musical "the King and I"..... erm, fag break...... when I came back in my cousin was reciting some bullcrap.... fag break take two! Anyhoo.... I now remember why I moved far north Sorry not to reply sooner but I have been "reuniting" with people I hope I will never have to re-unite with ever again...... "we must keep in touch"..... erm, please don't!  Funerals are a bloody waste of time.... you go to them expecting to see the dead person but are confronted by a bunch of karaoke type clowns who claim to be "family"..... erm, not related to any of them  When I go, I want to be chucked out with the rubbish (in a heavy duty bin liner) or just left to rot...... I certainly don't want a travelling circus appearing  |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2013 23:31:49 GMT
When I go, I want to be chucked out with the rubbish (in a heavy duty bin liner) or just left to rot...... ( I have to admit I fully concur with that sentiment. Grandparents, parents, brothers and the wife have all made their various desires for being laid to rest very clear. When I'm asked I just say tip my carcass into the landfill! At least a few bugs get a good feed, I'll certainly have no more use for it no matter how well it's served me. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2013 23:40:29 GMT
.... that reminds of a Cat Stevens song..... "Lord my body has been a good friend But I won't need it when I reach the end" Do you think he looks good with the YouTube play-button eye-patch  |
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Crispy
500+
"Done me wrong," it's the same old song" - forever
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Post by Crispy on Nov 24, 2013 15:17:02 GMT
When I go, I want to be chucked out with the rubbish (in a heavy duty bin liner) or just left to rot...... ( I have to admit I fully concur with that sentiment. Grandparents, parents, brothers and the wife have all made their various desires for being laid to rest very clear. When I'm asked I just say tip my carcass into the landfill! At least a few bugs get a good feed, I'll certainly have no more use for it no matter how well it's served me. Likewise, I always thought it would be cool if you knew exactly how old you would be and what day and time you would die. Armed with this information I would run riot in my last year or two and spend every single penny I owned having a great time, making sure my wife and daughter were ok. Then on the day of my death I would be sat in the gutter listening to The doors (The End) on my portable, then when I keel over dead into the street they can sweep me away with the rubbish, no fancy funerals.  |
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Post by PinkFloyd on Nov 24, 2013 20:18:16 GMT
Lights out, drift into a dream, turn to dust. What better way to go? I would prefer to go in an industrial grade bin liner and not be "sent off" in a 79 pence for 100 roll..... What a cheery place this has become. A sad day for X-PRE owners |
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Post by mattn on Nov 24, 2013 21:10:07 GMT
Hi Mike, That sounds excruciating!  Think I'd have joined you for a snout, even though I gave up 8 years ago! Love the rhyming slang (Wallace) , not much fun when a member of the extended family drops ‘brown-bread’ but singing ‘The King & I’ would have made me feel somewhat ‘Tom & Dick’. Religion is not my bag either, but if someone gets strength and happiness & meaning, it can’t be a bad thing, live and let live I say and all that sort of stuff! Happy to be fed to the pigs when I go, we already pay then enough in tax to them whilst we're alive! Still loving the X-Pre, so not such a bad day afterwards! ATB Matt |
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Post by dejanm on Feb 6, 2014 21:25:00 GMT
Do you have schematics of this pre ?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2014 23:42:17 GMT
Do you have schematics of this pre ? I am unaware of anyone other than approved Musical Fidelity repairers that have access to this schematic. There certainly does not appear to be any schematics that can be found using Google. You may need to reverse engineer a working unit. Alex. |
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Post by dejanm on Apr 20, 2014 17:29:04 GMT
Pink,
Will you be so kind and describe the benefits of exchanging tube basis ? I' ve seen on these pics that you have changed original MF bases ... Can you hear the difference and how2 would you describe that difference ?
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Post by Miguel on Nov 8, 2015 0:42:56 GMT
Hello.
Hope all members are doing well.
This is my first post in the forum...
I've got a x-cans v1 mooded with the kit Mike kindly provided and it sounds really wonderfull now!
I wonder if it would sound better with the x-pre between the cd player and the x-cans.
Thank you.
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jc
Fully Modded
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Post by jc on Nov 8, 2015 1:14:32 GMT
Hello Miguel and welcome to the forum.
If you wish to have extra inputs then it would obviously help but all you are really doing is adding a whole load of extra circuitry and interconnect cables to a comparatively minimalist and capable system, you'll more likely lose more than you gain in sound quality.
Another route is the X-10D line buffer. This was popular with several members here who felt it did improve the performance of a set up like yours.
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Post by Miguel on Nov 8, 2015 1:50:03 GMT
Thank's for the repply, cj!
The extra inputs are in deed one the things that made look at the x-pre over the x10-d.
At least one extra input would be welcome but if there isn't a considerable sound improvement it would turn out to be an expensive extra input.
I guess i'll consider the x-10d option and work arround an extra input directely in the x-cans.
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Post by Miguel on Nov 12, 2015 17:26:17 GMT
The x-cans did the extra input work for me.
Searching the forum found that the v2 had the rca inputs and outputs hardwired.
I did't open mine again but i believe it has also.
Thanks for the previous posts regarding this subject!
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Post by mikel2 on May 10, 2017 10:38:39 GMT
Hi Pink Floyd,
How much would a set of parts be for the Pre modification please?
Mike
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 10, 2017 19:21:55 GMT
Hi Pink Floyd, How much would a set of parts be for the Pre modification please? Mike Hi Mike, I will send you an e-mail. Best regards, Mike G. |
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Post by PinkFloyd on May 10, 2017 20:10:58 GMT
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I hope this thread is of help to Musical Fidelity X-PRE owners who want to bring their X-PRE's back to life (TURBO!) and it is a free tutorial. I will not be supplying a kit but can provide you with the correct parts you require if you ask me nicely 
