windmill9
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Not a female, that's a mistake!
Posts: 11
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Post by windmill9 on Apr 9, 2012 15:43:18 GMT
Collective pitch Nine Eagles 180 D - also known as the 318A 318mm rotor dia and weight 105gms, shown pictured beside a MSR X for comparison. If you know the E-flite Blade 120SR, it is a close size match, but the 318A has a 80mm smaller blade diameter, and is over 100 gms lighter. So why am I writing this? I will tell you! This helicopter is really great. It is a gem!! But the Transmitter it comes with is the biggest load of toenail clippings I have ever regretted licking! Let me explain. The 318A has a stiff ABS chassis, a nice tall ABS under-carriage, carbon tail-boom, and a steel main shaft. The rotor-head is flybarless, the stability being taken care of by a set of 3 axis gyros. Boy do you have to be on your toes, for the first hover, if your previous helicopter was a Solo Pro V2!! But it will hover if you let it do most of the work; I had to alter push rod lengths to get it to sit hands off. (With these gyro stabilized helicopters - you are flying the gyros and not the servos, with your 'stick' inputs. This takes a bit of getting used to; especially if you are tip-toeing near the ground. The gyros send commands to the servos, dependent on body roll. Consequently; if there is no body roll, a small stick deflection, will be transformed by the gyro into a large servo output). But the main departure from the mainstream plastic Helli brigade is the brushless (out-runner) motor, and the shaft driven tail rotor. The single brushless motor is tiny (18mm dia - 12mm tall) but it is a real stump-puller; the combination of low weight, high power, and collective pitch, means that height control is very precise and dynamic. Add in a powerful shaft driven tail rotor, and you have a recipe for ultimate happiness. It is so nice having tail control that has similar pilot authority in both directions; almost irrespective of throttle setting. Lastly, servos. Forget the mother board mounted screw-jack servos; the 318A has proper micro servos, 20x8x19mm on collective (3 off), with a bigger 22x8x20mm on the tail. These servos are fast and powerful, with great holding torque. Perfect! So there it is - the perfect Mini Helicopter. And the reason I would buy the e-flite MCP X instead is; the very poor Transmitter. The J6 pro (I shudder to contemplate what the 'Pro' stands for!!!) is too basic for the fine tuning and trimming that most people these days want to do. The throttle and pitch curves are 5 point and OK - but there is only one flight mode. The dual rates are all on one switch, and the Expo settings are not flight mode dependent - as far as I can tell! But worst of all. All the functions that the mighty J6 'pro' has at its disposal, are displayed on a single page! The only way that you can tell which function is being addressed, is by the odd flashing small icon. Futaba, JR, Spektrum; watch out!!! The J6 pro is coming - NOT! What would I like to see happen? I would like Nine Eagles to copy or license the Spektrum data transmission protocol so that I can use a reasonable quality transmitter with the Nine Eagles receiver/gyro. Nines Eagles 318A plus Spektrum DX6i, that would be perfection!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2012 18:07:18 GMT
So would I, Windmill. Welcome to the forum.
I hated the transmitter with the V2 and gave up because of it and now fly the MSRx instead. It very fast and a bit looney, but I have it under control now and really like it to be honest.
Funnily enough, I like the simplicity of the DX5e!! I have a DX6i but it's a bit fragile imo and I had really bad teething problems with it.
I have seen the Nine Eagle 120 size helis and they look good. I have the 120 sr and use the Nine Eagles blades on it actually.
The MCPx is a bugger to fly because not only is it quite ferocious and needs a bit of taming at first, but it's also a bit small and jittery in the breeze so I'm nervous of sending it too far away.
The MSRx, I can send 50 feet up easily (or maybe more) and feel confident with it, but not the MCPx. In fact, I lost sight of the MSRx up there once which was a bit disconcerting. It flies better outside than the 120 sr in the wind.
I quite fancy the fixed pitch Nine Eagles because of its size. You can see them a bit further away or up in the sky. Cheap as well.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 9, 2012 19:55:12 GMT
Possibly short for Problem? That J curve you were explaing earlier was very interesting, I'm sure Ian (Rabbit) would be interested in that as he does a fair bit of outside flying... maybe you can elaborate on here.
What was the Nine Eagles that was a bit bigger than the Solo pro you were mentioning? I'd be interested in that (the one WITH flybar).... a bit more grunt to fight the breeze and possibly a bit more pokey in flight too?
Mike.
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windmill9
Been here a while!
Not a female, that's a mistake!
Posts: 11
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Post by windmill9 on Apr 13, 2012 19:29:10 GMT
Am I alowed to reply to my own posts? I have been flying and crashing the Solo Pro 180D - I like the Helicopter just as much; but the Transmitter is going down in my estimation. I was thinking of getting a Walkera Devo 8 and linking it to one of Walkera's 3 axis receivers - has any one tried this yet? Photo time: My ariel fell off the Rx. I have re-soldered it - the mod being to route it up through the top of the Rx case, via a suitable 3mm hole. Two points of contact = more strength (I hope)! Beside the picture of the main drive gear, you will see a mangled screw. The mangled screw is a new fixing device, as used by Nine Eagles, to secure the main drive gear to the main shaft. (The pen points to the 1.2mm unthreaded hole that the mangled screw fits into). My upgrade here will be to use a roll pin or a split-pin.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2012 21:07:58 GMT
Am I alowed to reply to my own posts? Ooooh no!! Does it responds well to crashes, Sam? At least, well enough to hold together. That's one thing I don't like with even the MCPx. Smack that into the deck and it starts to have hissy fits in the air. The remote that comes with it I presume is programmable? I was flying the MCPx with both a DX6i and a 5e so I had the same amount of negative pitch as positive. (on the 5e) If the Solo is the same, I imagine it's pretty ferocious both going up ...... and coming down. I made a stupid mistake with the MCPx. Flew it too far away to the point where you start to lose physical contact with its sound and also the slight 'buffets' that it gets in the breeze. Came down like a torpedo. Something the size of the pro would take that worse I imagine. Have you tried any blade balancing? I need to work out how to do this. I've also realised that you're in the deep north so if you're flying this outside, you're a brave fella. The winds must be awful!!!! It's bad enough down here in Surrey. One sniff of a breeze and my helis all start to do a fandango in the sky. Is it a difficult job to replace the receiver? That way, you may be able to bind it to something better. Where did you get the Pro Sam? The shop in Edinburgh seems to have everything sold out.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 14, 2012 8:04:47 GMT
Fantastic concept, trust the Chinese to be ahead of the game! No wonder my helicopters all fly like shite, they use straight screws.... so what we are saying here is to hit our screws with a hammer and mangle them?
I would personally go with a paper clip Windmill9.... fire it through and then snip at both ends.... the "snip" should give you enough width to prevent the pin from dropping out during flight.... either that or your good old fashioned "grub" screw.... just nip that puppy up and she should be good to go for many hours "stick" time..... you know anyway, you can't teach your granny how to suck eggs... you could probably teach her how to ride a sybian but no way can you teach her how to suck eggs.... anyhoooo......
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 14, 2012 9:50:00 GMT
Probably down at Wick harbour.... quite a few of them floating about down there I believe.... they'll play with your chopper for a bag of chips and a bottle of white lightning cider..... very good VFM
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2012 11:49:56 GMT
Is that the place where they do the now famous 'crushed ice'? ;D
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 14, 2012 19:54:58 GMT
Is that the place where they do the now famous 'crushed ice'? ;D You'll get ice at Wick harbour but not part of an "intermediate" course.... More like chunks of it they keep the freshly caught fish fresh with..... for the crushed stuff you have to go the Captain's galley in Scrabster and pay £160 for a wankfest of pretentious cooked fished Windmill9..... can you please explain the J curve?
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windmill9
Been here a while!
Not a female, that's a mistake!
Posts: 11
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Post by windmill9 on Apr 16, 2012 11:06:01 GMT
My purveyor of choice at the moment is Hobby-Wing.com (but buy from their Aussy web site, the conversion rate is better).
I find the guys in Edinburgh very helpful - but every one is fighting shy of stocking the 180D and the appropriate spare parts. in the UK.
It seems to be moderately robust, for a bigger-micro sized helicopter. Not as good as an MSR, but way better than a cx2. The 180D main blades are rather good. Strong; but not so heavy that they take out the feathering shaft on every impact.
Has any one tried the Walkera V120D02S yet? It is slightly smaller and lighter than the 180D and best of all it comes with a good Walkera transmitter. I am wary of helicopters that have too many bits of aluminium in them - they do not bounce on impact!
I am writing to Nine Eagles - they need help in the transmitter department.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2012 13:01:48 GMT
I changed the CX3 body for a Lama V4 body. It's more robust. It also seems to fly slightly better with it!! Less 'twiches' on the tail.
The MSRx blade grips are a real pain. I flew just 9 flights on a new set outdoors before one of the balls broke away yet again.
Trouble is, it was just a speck in the sky and very high up when it decided it better do an emergency landing. Luckily, it hit grass and was ok but thos grips are trouble. We need a supplier of metal blade grips over here in the UK.
This is the thing with all helis. Spares need to be easily got hold of because a crash is virtually inevitable. That's on thing that has put me off Walkeras. The availability of spares is crucial and can make or break sales for the companies.
I'd like to try the Walkera 120.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Apr 16, 2012 22:06:28 GMT
VERY good point and I am in TOTAL agreement Windmill. Your swash horn mods on my Big Lama did the trick, absolutely superb... it was rocketing around the hall on Sunday (and where were you may I ask? )..... I'd bought my Hacker (1974 vintage radio) along and it actually filled the hall with sound (Johnny Walker, sounds of the 70's).... anyhoo...... I got into a bit of a "dance" with the Lama and, yup (you guessed it), it went smashing into a wall at full throttle. Cracked canopy, Bent shaft (again) and 50 pence worth of blades taken out.... if the blade grips had been plastic the shaft would have been protected as the grips would have taken the impact (absorbed it).... these "alu" parts are all very well but result in more expensive repairs every time you get over complacent and end up saying hello to a WALL.... there's a LOT to be said for plastic parts, they save you doing a total strip down every time you have a mama honker BASH into a brick wall! Aluminium bumpers are not employed on cars.... sure, they would "look" good but would they be practical? NO! we need a bit of bounce when we have a tendancy to fly moving objects into a wall.... without that "bounce", that shock absorption, that elasticity, that ability to bounce like a superball we are effectively looking at major wallet time every time we "hit" one of these alu wankfests into a wall. Remember the superball? That fantastic 1970's invention.... it bounced, it bounced, it bounced, it bounced.... it was indesrtructable. What we need is a helicopter made out of superball material (not fekkin' aluminium)...... Thing is, as all of us know (unless you're an IDIOT who doesn't), the "helicopter", per se, is not the end of the transaction.... it's the beginning of a pretty costly relationship with a man (operating out of a garden shed) who will charge you £8 for a piece of plastic, £6 for a few screws, £20 for a set of blades.... this is where these weazels make their money. The Big Lama Pro is as cheap as chips to repair.... 40 blades for under a tenner but take out the Wankera LM180D and you are looking at £30 to £40 per "HIT"..... the secret with the Wankera is not to crash it.... easy to do but hovering becomes quite boring after a while, I like to let rip. Ian, you are ALSO correctamundo.... spares, and availability of spares is the first thing to look into. I made a HUGE mistake with the Walkera LM180D, nobody in the UK stocks them and you really don't want to have to wait weeks for a set of replacement blades. We are obviously ALL "wankeras".... the only reason we are crashing is because we start getting a bit too cocky.... we are not "pushing the envelope", we are out of control and, WHAMMO!, straight into a wall / tree or other hard object. I think what we ALL have to do is to start learning how to walk before even attempting a gentle trot (or a run).... a genuine pilot doesn't keep smashing helicopters into buildings, killing passengers, causing general mayhem yet us knuckleheads seem to do it quite frequently Hovering is BORING but I hovered my Walkera LM180D for over 20 minutes on Sunday (two battery changes) and it came out intact. Windmill was correct from DAY one....... start with an MCX2 and work up the range slowly.... yup, I'm good with that.... the only thing he didn't factor in was the natural "urge" a human being has to get carried away and really push these things to the limit..... They're all perfectly good, it's our natural urge / requirement to show fekkin' off that usually sees them smashing into walls.... if we really "were" boring sad bastards all we "would" be doing is hovering them and they would remain intact for years.... thing is, we're not.... We all like pushing the envelope in our own individual ways....
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windmill9
Been here a while!
Not a female, that's a mistake!
Posts: 11
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Post by windmill9 on Apr 23, 2012 19:35:11 GMT
First big crash today.
Damage;
3mm cut in mahogany garden chair.
Split swashplate. Bent feathering shaft. One shattered main blade holder.
Surprisingly the main blades are ok; well done Nine Eagles for making main blades that can take a knock. However are they too stiff?
I am going to try the thin flexible blades off a Solo Pro 328. My hope is that they will bounce and bend on contact - there-bye saving the £25 parts bill. Are Solo Pro 180D plastic blade grips brittle?
Hobby-Wing are now no longer my preferred purveyor of Nine Eagles parts. I have found Toymall99 on e-bay; they do not charge carriage and they appear to put 'gift' on the customs declaration. Tut-Tut!
Hope to have a stick twiddle of a Walkera 120D02S soon, I am told that they can be set-up in quite a benign way.
Like quite a few of us I have reached the stage where I can chuck around a MSRx, but the jump to a collective machine is quite a leap skill and perception wise.
How is every one else managing?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2012 20:12:12 GMT
Funnily enough Sam, I found a Blade 450 easier to fly than an MCPx. The little one is too flighty and all over the place in a breeze but the 450 holds much better and feels a lot more secure. I was fortunate enough to fly one with an instructor so I've been back. He assures me he's not doing much on the buddy box but I must admit, it's less twitchy. Trouble is with the bigger ones is you can only fly outside safely, really or else the damage can be quite considerable; even with an MCPx. TBH, it's less enjoyable as well when you're fighting to keep the damned thing still. I tried some different blades on a 120sr - the big solo pro blades. It flew but I had troubles with shakes so I went back to the Blade ones. However, I've changed the central pillar, blade grip, feathering shaft and motor cog at the bottom so maybe I'll give it another go. I'd like to try and mess around with blade tracking and balancing since I'm not convinced that the blades are made that well balanced in the first place. I've been concentrating on getting the MSRx to fly like a Nancy indoors. Another problem is the blasted Spektrum transmitters. I really like the way that they work but they are SO unreliable. Nothing but problems. DX6i a switch fell inside and went to pieces. DX5e - one of the trimming adjusters packed in!! They're not reliable so I'm using a stock little black transmitter now, would you believe? Even with the 120sr. You actually get used to it after a while.
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