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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2011 3:58:52 GMT
AND it will more than likely stay this way, as Sony does not want this capability which could eventually lead to SACD anti copying measures being compromised, the same way that DVD-A has been.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2011 8:53:34 GMT
Don't bet your life on it, many "impossible" hurdles have been jumped over...
Remember when BD was launched and promoted its latest tech ultra secure uncrackable security? it just took a few months because it had a big user base so there was lots of interest. SACD on the other hand has always been a tiny niche market and hasn't generated interest in the crackers circles to get at it but lately that seems to be changing.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2011 9:21:53 GMT
Don't bet your life on it, many "impossible" hurdles have been jumped over... Remember when BD was launched and promoted its latest tech ultra secure uncrackable security? it just took a few months because it had a big user base so there was lots of interest. SACD on the other hand has always been a tiny niche market and hasn't generated interest in the crackers circles to get at it but lately that seems to be changing. Hi Javier What I meant was that Microsoft will not permit it, and Sony will resist SACD playback on a PC. DVD-A playback on the other hand was supported by the likes of CMPS.It will need to be hacked to happen. Alex. |
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XTRProf
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Post by XTRProf on Aug 23, 2011 9:39:17 GMT
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Post by pcourtney1 on Aug 23, 2011 9:50:21 GMT
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XTRProf
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Post by XTRProf on Aug 23, 2011 10:20:22 GMT
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joethearachnid
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Post by joethearachnid on Aug 23, 2011 10:40:57 GMT
The problem with SACDs is the hardware, not the software. I actuaully did a Physics project on digital storage discs (which I got full marks for  ) and ended up reading a lot about SACDs. Broadly, you need a specialised drive that can use a beam that can focus through the 44.1 CD layer and hit the SACD layer. Sadly most SACD players are prohibitively expensive, though the latest generations of Sony Blu-ray players (the cheapest of which can be has for just over £100) CAN play SACDs. It's the main reason why I wanted to get one. -JoetheArachnid. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2011 10:42:57 GMT
Chong
It does not specifically say that it can play SACD discs.
I read it as being able to handle DSD files .
Alex
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XTRProf
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Post by XTRProf on Aug 23, 2011 10:49:25 GMT
Seriously, I'm also confused. But they did mention SACD and play in that statement. Really dunno what it meant specifically.  |
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Post by pcourtney1 on Aug 23, 2011 14:13:55 GMT
it just means "play at sa-cd quality". not actually play an sacd disc, those press release writers for Sony are not the best for laying out copy that is easily understood, especially if you are reading it quickly !
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2011 15:55:30 GMT
Latest version of the SACD plugin: sourceforge.net/projects/sacddecoder/files/foo_input_sacd/foo_input_sacd-0.3.1.zip/downloadChange log: 09/09/11: Version 0.3.1 - DSD to PCM converter performance a bit mproved. 09/07/11: Version 0.3.0 - Experimental: new DSD to PCM converter. 08/25/11: Version 0.2.9 - DSDIFF tag reader added. 08/25/11: Version 0.2.8 - DSD Fs128 support added. 08/24/11: Version 0.2.7 - Tag mapping fixed. 08/23/11: Version 0.2.6 - Seek in DSD mode fixed. 08/22/11: Version 0.2.5 - Memory leak in DST decoder fixed. 08/21/11: Version 0.2.4 - Experimental: SSE enabled DST decoder. 08/06/11: Version 0.2.3 - Experimental: ASIO DSD/PCM autodetection. 08/02/11: Version 0.2.2 - More seamless playback. 08/01/11: Version 0.2.1 - Output PCM samplerate selector added. 07/29/11: Version 0.2.0 - Experimental: ASIO direct DSD support added. PCM volume adjuct gauge added. 07/19/11: Version 0.1.3 - DSDIFF file playback added. 07/16/11: Version 0.1.2 - DSD track playback added. 07/15/11: Version 0.1.1 - Reading of 2064 bytes sector images (Philips SuperAuthor) added. 07/14/11: Version 0.1.0 - Playback added. 07/07/11: Version 0.0.0 - DST decoder performance test, no real playback. |
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Post by JohnnyBlue on Sept 15, 2011 6:37:15 GMT
Thanks for your efforts here, Javier. I've been running foobar for a few months now, so had already worked out most of the things you've described.
I'm still struggling, however, to play 24 bit downloads via WASAPI into my Aune Mini USB DAC. If I select 24 bit in the ouput, I get an error message, unless I run the resampler option, but I've read that this is a PC resources muncher, and in any case presumably it's resampling so I'm not getting 24 bit (?).
If I set DS (i.e., not WASAPI) in the foobar output settings, the bit selection dropdown is greyed out, and all files (16 and 24 bit) play fine, but I'd prefer the better sound via WASAPI.
Any suggestions?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2011 8:33:59 GMT
The Aune uses the TI PCM2707 for USB input which is limited to 16bit at either 44.1 or 48KHZ.
Both WASAPI and ASIO will give you an error outputting >16bit because that DAC doesn't accept 24bit.
DS will work because it always resamples and dithers to the resolution configured in the drivers which, of course, will be compatible with the DAC's input.
The whole point of WASAPI and ASIO is skipping that resampling and dithering provinding the cleanest and shortest path to the DAC but in the Aune case the advantage won't be that big. There could be a point in using WASAPI together a higher quality resampling plugin, such as SOX in HQ mode, which could do the job better than Windows KMixer. Still dithering will have to be applied to 24bit files, either by the KMixer or by Foobar.
If you wanted to avoid dithering and resampling you'll need to upgrade to a DAC with a better USB input or if, the Aune accepts 24/192 on its SPDIF, get an external USB to SPDIF adapter like the JKenny, Musiland 01, Teralink-X2, etc. that supports al resolutions you want as some are based on the Tenor 7022 incapable of playing 88.2 and 176.4KHz.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2011 8:38:54 GMT
New version of Fidelizer available fixing the mess introduced in 2.0: Warning: don't delete 1.6 just in case... www.windowsxlive.net/download/fidelizer.zipI haven't tried it yet so cannot comment, will do as soon as I have. |
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Post by JohnnyBlue on Sept 15, 2011 9:55:07 GMT
The Aune uses the TI PCM2707 for USB input which is limited to 16bit at either 44.1 or 48KHZ. Both WASAPI and ASIO will give you an error outputting >16bit because that DAC doesn't accept 24bit. DS will work because it always resamples and dithers to the resolution configured in the drivers which, of course, will be compatible with the DAC's input. The whole point of WASAPI and ASIO is skipping that resampling and dithering provinding the cleanest and shortest path to the DAC but in the Aune case the advantage won't be that big. There could be a point in using WASAPI together a higher quality resampling plugin, such as SOX in HQ mode, which could do the job better than Windows KMixer. Still dithering will have to be applied to 24bit files, either by the KMixer or by Foobar. If you wanted to avoid dithering and resampling you'll need to upgrade to a DAC with a better USB input or if, the Aune accepts 24/192 on its SPDIF, get an external USB to SPDIF adapter like the JKenny, Musiland 01, Teralink-X2, etc. that supports al resolutions you want as some are based on the Tenor 7022 incapable of playing 88.2 and 176.4KHz. Thanks, Javier, for taking the time to explain this to me. Much appreciated. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2011 13:45:50 GMT
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FauDrei
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Post by FauDrei on Sept 26, 2011 19:25:34 GMT
foo_input_sacd went to 0.3.6. Fidelizer 2.1 is working properly on multicore systems (tested on dual core 7x64 SP1). "Fidelizing" foobar2000 with 2.1 (>= audiophile optimization level) brings (again) audible playback improvements. Highly recommended. Javier - thanks for your effort in this thread. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2011 19:55:31 GMT
Happy to be of any help!
Its amazing the rate at which this guy keeps improving the SACD plugin, BTW he also wrote the DVD-A one.
0.3.6 only brings editable tags but 0.3.5 included polyphase filtering.
Perhaps in the not so distant future we'll start seeing DSD over USB drivers and affordable DACs capable of both PCM and DSD. It can be done now (ExaUI + Buffalo II/III) buit the cost is still to high.
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XTRProf
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Post by XTRProf on Sept 28, 2011 13:50:45 GMT
It seems there is a stable Foobar2000 1.1.8 now. I've downloaded it and wonder whether it's that stable.  All the rest of the older components can be used without crashing for this newer stable version? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2011 14:11:52 GMT
I've 1.1.8 and no probs so far. I installed it over 1.1.7 without any issue whatsoever.
Try it and if anything happens you can always uninstall and revert to previous.
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XTRProf
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Post by XTRProf on Sept 28, 2011 15:09:32 GMT
Have been comparing between foolbar 1.1.8 with WMP 12 (both in it's basic guise) in my HP laptop with my Razer Orca HP. Don't hear any clear cut improvement of one over the other. Will compare to VLC as well when there is time as now have to sleep as it's again nearing 12 midnight. Must install flac plugin later to enable Foolbar to play hirez flac. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2011 15:36:05 GMT
Have you configured Foobar as per 1st post?
If you are using the default configuration in all players chances are they'll sound very similar if not exactly the same.
BTW, there is no plugin needed for Foobar to play FLAC at any rez, it plays them all natively.
EDIT: I just noticed you are using a laptop, are you using its on board sound card? if so, install at least WASAPI plugin for Foobar and configure it as output.
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XTRProf
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Post by XTRProf on Sept 28, 2011 22:39:52 GMT
Have you configured Foobar as per 1st post? If you are using the default configuration in all players chances are they'll sound very similar if not exactly the same. No, just instal and play in it's basic configuration. BTW, there is no plugin needed for Foobar to play FLAC at any rez, it plays them all natively. EDIT: I just noticed you are using a laptop, are you using its on board sound card? if so, install at least WASAPI plugin for Foobar and configure it as output. But when click play it with play it with Foolbar, there was the didn't recognise the format and had to search MS website for resolution. Do we need a reboot after instal to play? Yes, just using the onboard laptop sound card to play. That was why I state in it's basic guise as in a higher resolution system, there could be a difference. Noted what you had said. Btw, is the Wasapi needed if we use a 192khz 24 bits usb to spdif dongle to dac? You are really of great help here. Thanks for your excellent effort.  |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2011 22:54:08 GMT
Chong
With my PC using the Asus Xonar D2X card and coax SPDIF into the X-DAC V3, with the later ASIO driver for the Asus card, as given to me by Javier, it still sounds markedly inferior to the less user friendly cPlay, which plays from system memory. I expect that the paid for XXHE which also plays from system memory, would also eat the "Swiss Knife" for breakfast in the area of SQ.
Still, if you needed to play a handful of SACDs as well, then Foobar with that plugin would be the one to use.
Alex
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XTRProf
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Post by XTRProf on Sept 28, 2011 23:11:15 GMT
Chong With my PC using the Asus Xonar D2X card and coax SPDIF into the X-DAC V3, with the later ASIO driver for the Asus card, as given to me by Javier, it still sounds markedly inferior to the less user friendly cPlay, which plays from system memory. I expect that the paid for XXHE which also plays from system memory, would also eat the "Swiss Knife" for breakfast in the area of SQ. Still, if you needed to play a handful of SACDs as well, then Foobar with that plugin would be the one to use. Alex Good morning (still is in Australia  ) Alex, That's where things start to get interesting for us subjectivists. The decoding by numbers in the engine is still the same "perfection" by objectivist standard. Btw, the SACD part is only provided we can rip from SACD to DSD iso thru an old PS3. So far, have you seen any other solution to SACD ripping? |
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) and ended up reading a lot about SACDs. Broadly, you need a specialised drive that can use a beam that can focus through the 44.1 CD layer and hit the SACD layer. Sadly most SACD players are prohibitively expensive, though the latest generations of Sony Blu-ray players (the cheapest of which can be has for just over £100) CAN play SACDs. It's the main reason why I wanted to get one.
) Alex,