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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 21, 2009 21:24:00 GMT
Dammit, the connection at the jack end of the cable became intermittent (quite typical of these Sennheiser cables) so I had to fit a new jack on.... it was maybe a blessing in disguise as I am sure the 'phones sound a bit better with a one piece jack than the two piece affair Sennheiser fit...... I used that Cardas eutectic solder (got it "free" with some Cardas connectors I bought) and also managed to thread a couple of ferrite beads over the wires.... I don't know if this has actually made the SQ better or if it's placebo but, to my ears, there definitely appears to be improvement in clarity and bass extension. If you ever have to do this be warned that the Sennheiser "wires" are thinner than hair and you have to be very careful when you cut them so they don't fray.... you also have to flood a lot of solder over the ends with a hot iron to tin them.... I used a Neutrik NP3X-B professional 6.3mm Jack (My preferred jack) as there's plenty of room inside to fit goodies like ferrite beads and what have you.... they also clamp the cable very well so no danger of anything working loose over time.... they're only a few quid and well worth the money IMO..... I may well buy a few and terminate all my 'phones with them.... Aftermarket cables, and the concept / price of aftermarket cables never really appealed to me but after hearing the Cardas cable and dabbling with my own home made cables I am now a firm believer that "stock" Sennheiser cables are nothing but the minimum to do the job.... they are CERTAINLY not as "tough" as they are claimed to be, I've lost count of the amount of Senn cables that have gone pear shaped on me over the years, and the "hair" that the signal passes through is far from quality IMO. Anyways...... here's the latest addition to my HD-250 ll:
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insomniac
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Post by insomniac on Sept 22, 2009 0:59:07 GMT
Another fan of the Neutrik professional jack's here.. really nice quality and well engineered. The chuck type cable grip is a neat touch.
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FauDrei
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Post by FauDrei on Sept 22, 2009 8:46:07 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 22, 2009 22:45:45 GMT
Spirit (Phil) how are you getting on with yours mate?
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Sept 22, 2009 23:05:06 GMT
Still pretty much as I said Mike - fairly sure I've ended up with a dud pair as it were.
Got ~48 hours on now, and HD600s still have quite a bit more kick to them. 250s have more treble detail in places [with scha as set up as it is].
If nothing else, it's making me appreciate the 600s more ;D
Will probably sell the 250s, and hope for better luck next time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2009 23:31:46 GMT
Phil 48 hours with headphones is nowhere near enough. Ideally you also need to find the manufacturer's recommended driving impedance, and set the output resistor values in the SC HA accordingly. Let's see what value output resistors Leo finds best with his SC HA and Class A HA with the 250s. As an example , it was a revelation with the ATH W1000 when I went from 68 ohms to the IEC value of 100 ohms. Alex
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leo
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Post by leo on Sept 23, 2009 0:10:03 GMT
Still pretty much as I said Mike - fairly sure I've ended up with a dud pair as it were. Got ~48 hours on now, and HD600s still have quite a bit more kick to them. 250s have more treble detail in places [with scha as set up as it is]. If nothing else, it's making me appreciate the 600s more ;D Will probably sell the 250s, and hope for better luck next time. They don't suit all ears and especially kit Phil so its possible you won't get on with any of them I use mine mainly as a tool, they can sound real shite if even the smallest thing in the chain is a bit off HD600 and especially HD650 may sound more pleasing with a wider range of kit and material BTW did you try your HD600 cable with the HD250's?
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leo
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Post by leo on Sept 23, 2009 0:18:10 GMT
Phil 48 hours with headphones is nowhere near enough. Ideally you also need to find the manufacturer's recommended driving impedance, and set the output resistor values in the SC HA accordingly. Let's see what value output resistors Leo finds best with his SC HA and Class A HA with the 250s. As an example , it was a revelation with the ATH W1000 when I went from 68 ohms to the IEC value of 100 ohms. Alex I use the classA a lot more than the SCHA with these cans , output resistors I use are 120R, not tried many others yet tbh If he was to make another cable (rather than chop the supplied one up which may affect selling value) he could of course go balanced directly on the outputs of Buffalo
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Sept 23, 2009 0:36:54 GMT
Can't swap cables Leo 'cause the 600 plugs are slightly different to the 250 ones. Well I could, but I'd have to shave a fair bit off the edges We'll see what happens with some more hours, and when I build the buffalo. Can hang on to them in the meantime...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2009 4:36:43 GMT
Phil If you replace the 68 ohm output resistors in your SC HA with either 100 or 120 ohm MF resistors, you should be able to tell if Leo and Mike are having themselves on, or not. Alex
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 23, 2009 19:51:12 GMT
Phil If you replace the 68 ohm output resistors in your SC HA with either 100 or 120 ohm MF resistors, you should be able to tell if Leo and Mike are having themselves on, or not. Alex Actually Alex it is "known" in the HD250ll circle that some have heat dissipation rings in the drivers and others do not..... it has been verified that the ones with the heat dissipation rings sound inferior to the ones without the heat dissipation rings. I can 100% also confirm that the Bass on my pair of HD-250ll absolutely TROUNCES the HD-600... as has been mentioned by several 250 owners, it sounds like a subwoofer has been strapped onto the side of them. Leo, Iancraig and myself are not "having ourselves on" we are experienced listeners and do not make such claims unless they are totally justified. I can only guess, by the sound of things, that Phil's pair has the heat dissipation rings fitted which is why they are not blowing the HD-600's away in the bass dept. Mike.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2009 20:17:40 GMT
Mike I found recently the very large improvement right across the board, that changing series output resistors from 68 ohms to 100 ohms, when using the ATH W1000 with the SC HA (JLH) , as well as the Class A HA made. Phil would be far more likely to duplicate Leo's and your own results if he did that. At the very least he would expect an improvement in the overall tonal balance. Leo also said that he was using 120 ohm series resistors in the Class A HA when feeding his 250s. Alex P.S. You took my comment too literally, as Leo knows that I accept his SQ results without reservation,which is why I asked him what value output resistors he was using.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 23, 2009 20:42:41 GMT
Mike I found recently the very large improvement right across the board, that changing series output resistors from 68 ohms to 100 ohms, when using the ATH W1000 with the SC HA (JLH) , as well as the Class A HA made. Phil would be far more likely to duplicate Leo's and your own results if he did that. At the very least he would expect an improvement in the overall tonal balance. Leo also said that he was using 120 ohm series resistors in the Class A HA when feeding his 250s. Alex P.S. You took my comment too literally, as Leo knows that I accept his SQ results without reservation. Alex, my findings with the HD250ll were based on amps with output resistances of almost ZERO ohms up to amps with output resistances of closer to 120R.... the massive bass is there no matter what the OI.... I very much doubt that Phil will see a massive increase in bass by notching the OI up to 120 in his SCHA. I will repeat, again, it is WIDELY known in the HD-250ll circle that there are TWO differing versions.... one that has a heat dissipation ring and the other that doesn't.... it is generally accepted that the HD250 WITHOUT the heat dissipation ring sounds a LOT better than the ones with it..... it has ZILCH to do with output impedance. Unfortunately, there is no way to tell before you buy.... you're either LUCKY or UNLUCKY. My guess is Phil has a pair that has heat dissipation rings fitted to the driver. FWIW I believe the "older" HD250ll are the ones WITHOUT the dissipation rings. There is one enthusiast who buys each and every pair he sees on ebay and keeps the good uns' and resells the not so good ones..... I doubt he will continue to win all of them for rock bottom prices now the word is out If I've got a spare minute tomorrow I'll ring a contact at Sennheiser UK and see if he can go into more depth about the heat dissipation rings (ie: "when" they started fitting them to the HD250ll) and if there's any way of removing the bastard things Mike.
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Sept 23, 2009 22:53:42 GMT
If I've got a spare minute tomorrow I'll ring a contact at Sennheiser UK and see if he can go into more depth about the heat dissipation rings (ie: "when" they started fitting them to the HD250ll) and if there's any way of removing the bastard things Cheers Mike
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 26, 2009 20:44:27 GMT
Phoned Sennehiser and the tech guy is "aware" of the heat dissipation rings but could not provide any detail of "when" they started to fit them. As to the MAJOR difference in SQ, again he couldn't comment only saying "both versions would have measured the same"...... a lot of bloody use that phone call was! I have been listening to all my 'phones today and just can't get into ANY of them any more.... the HD-250ll experience is such that most other 'phones just sound totally wrong now.... once you have had a dose of that TURBO bass there is no going back... K-701, W-1000, HD-600, SR-225 etc. sound like those in ear things you get with cheap transistor radios in comparison. Nigel, do you realise what you've done mate? You've put me off my ENTIRE headphone collection with these 'phones.... I'm sitting here with K-701 on my noggin and thinking "WTF!"..... "where's the bloody bass!"
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 26, 2009 21:41:50 GMT
Phil..... Didn't you buy your pair from this guy? SEE HEREFunny he has "another" pair up for sale so soon ;D Mike.
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Nigel
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Post by Nigel on Sept 26, 2009 21:46:50 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 26, 2009 22:01:06 GMT
That's good, I always knew your theory about needing a few pairs of 'phones for different occasions was flawed mate. The proof of the pudding & all that. What's the best choice of amp partnering? Not at all mate.... I am still FIRMLY of the opinion you need a few different pairs of 'phones for different occasions (and a few different amps)....... Hit me with some Martin Taylor (for example) and I'll reach for the K-701 (they do jazz beautifully) hit me with some Jean Michel Jarre and I'll reach for the W-1000..... some Floyd, I'll reach for the HD-600 maybe.... The HD-250 happen to do BASS so well and I am currently creaming my pants over them..... they have added the component that has always been missing.... ie: proper "Bass"..... This is not to say I no longer enjoy a bass light / balanced presentation cause I do.
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leo
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Post by leo on Sept 26, 2009 22:35:51 GMT
Very interesting! The HD250's are easy to take to bits, helps if we know exactly what these heat rings are supposed to look like I'll have another search
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Sept 27, 2009 3:20:44 GMT
Yeah... they were from Colin.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2009 14:07:49 GMT
Not at all mate.... I am still FIRMLY of the opinion you need a few different pairs of 'phones for different occasions (and a few different amps)....... . That's my excuse too!! They all do different things in a different way. The great thing about the HD200 II is that unlike a lot of other headphones with strong bass, these things don't play bass unless it's actually there on the recording. There's no sense of 'colouring' the sound to impress with bass. If you listen to speech on them, they don't make mens' voices sound 'boomy' like a great many other headphones with strong bass output. Any sign of a velour pad for them? Ian
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2009 14:52:49 GMT
Phil..... Didn't you buy your pair from this guy? SEE HEREFunny he has "another" pair up for sale so soon ;D Mike. The Old Listing Phil bought from has the same "this is my spare set..." description. 2 spares eh? Maybe 3 next month, does anybody smell something nasty
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 27, 2009 19:55:55 GMT
[ That's my excuse too!! They all do different things in a different way. The great thing about the HD200 II is that unlike a lot of other headphones with strong bass, these things don't play bass unless it's actually there on the recording. There's no sense of 'colouring' the sound to impress with bass. Yup, there is no "one" pair of headphones that will do everything right and no two pairs of ears that are the same so it's pretty much essential to own, at least, 3 pairs of headphones IMO. I totally agree with you re: the HD-250ll...... if there's bass on the recording they will transduce it to your ears in gooooood measure, they don't add or subtract anything from the mix. No word on the velour pads Ian (I did ask) I don't think there would be enough demand to be honest.... it's not exactly a "popular" headphone is it? I'll chase him up again but am not holding out much hope. Mike.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2009 20:18:54 GMT
Just a thought.
Would the Beyer DT880 doughnuts fit? I seem to remember they are a similar size - didn't like the 880 in the end.
Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 27, 2009 20:33:01 GMT
Just a thought. Would the Beyer DT880 doughnuts fit? I seem to remember they are a similar size - didn't like the 880 in the end. Ian Haven't got a clue Ian
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