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Post by fault151 on Nov 5, 2007 16:36:16 GMT
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Nov 5, 2007 21:17:31 GMT
Well do you want Non-Oversampling (NOS), Oversampling, ...? What kind of connectivity do you want - USB, Optical, Coaxial, or a combination? How much money do you want to spend? Do you have a size restriction?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2007 21:34:53 GMT
Fault151 Add to Miguel's list : Is this DAC to be an initial DAC ONLY,(toe in the water) or do you want a DAC that will grow with your system, and not limit SQ if you upgrade other things ? SandyK
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Post by dc on Nov 5, 2007 22:20:34 GMT
Also, is eye candy (ie. bling) important?
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Nov 6, 2007 1:06:36 GMT
Also, is eye candy (ie. bling) important? Bling? the only bling worth talking about is the little tassels w/ sparkles that strippers put at the end of their ... Oops, wrong forum!
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Post by PinkFloyd on Nov 6, 2007 11:59:32 GMT
also.... do you want it to have an alarm clock, a tea maker and disco light module or just a plain DAC?
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Post by fault151 on Nov 6, 2007 14:19:30 GMT
hi guys, sorry for the late reply! Im looking for a DAC that will be used from home, reasonable price, not too fussed about the look (as long as it doesn't look pig ugly or from the stone age!, i would like to upgrade in the future as my knowledge in audio grows, i don't have any other DAC, so its a first for me. The only one i have seen is the x-dac v3.
Any advice is welcomed!
Cheers!
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Nov 6, 2007 19:40:27 GMT
Well here are some alternatives at various prices. There are many more, so this is an small list: - $100 Silverstone EB01 - $175 Lite Dac-AH non oversampling dac - $250 Fubar II USB Dac by Firestone Audio - $300 HeadRoom Micro Dac (2006 and older) so use for $250 - $399 Spitfire Dac by Firestone Audio - $500 Musical Fidelity X-Dac V3 - $700 Ultra Micro Dac by HeadRoom I stopped at $700 because that at the moment is my limit. However check the Cambridge CD 740C. You will be surprised.
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Post by fault151 on Nov 6, 2007 20:51:50 GMT
cheers mrarroyo thats helped a lot! i'll search google for them and have a look. I think realisticly i'm looking around the 399-500 range. Will all these be able to be upgraded?
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Post by capunk on Nov 7, 2007 3:04:27 GMT
- $200 - iBasso D1 (used/ N/A atm) - $255 - Zhaolu 2.5 - $300 - Constantine II USB - $399 - Moodlab Dice - $599 - Paradisea +
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Post by charleyphogg on Nov 7, 2007 3:25:44 GMT
Well do you want Non-Oversampling (NOS), Oversampling, ...? What kind of connectivity do you want - USB, Optical, Coaxial, or a combination? How much money do you want to spend? Do you have a size restriction? I'm guessing here, but would a non-oversampling dac only do 16 bit/44.1 khz? And if so, other then future upgrades, is there any noticable advantage to over samping ? Example..... why over sample a 16 bit to 24 bit only to have it comeback out 16 bit? I'm trying to learn and retain the origianl post.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2007 9:59:25 GMT
charleyphogg The attached link may help explain things a little. www.earlevel.com/Digital%20Audio/Oversampling.htmlSometimes you can obtain audibly better results by upsampling from 44.1KHZ 16 bits to 48KHZ 24 bits. On good material, it can have a more natural sound . In this case you would burn the new version to a DVD-R for playback on a DVD player, or via your PC from it's HDD. Leo is the guy to ask about NOS versus OS DACs. Personally, I prefer OverSampling DACs. SandyK
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leo
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Post by leo on Nov 7, 2007 11:41:12 GMT
Leo is the guy to ask about NOS versus OS DACs. Personally, I prefer OverSampling DACs. SandyK I have both, TDA1541S2 for NOS and PCM1794 for OS, both are very good, just different Fault151, I'd certainly have a listen to few different types first if possible. The NOS ones are harder to get right so be weary with some of the NOS types you see on places like ebay unless you can pick one dirt cheap as a first dac. Personally never liked any of the MF dacs in standard form including the X-dacs but understand the V3 is supposed to sound decent after a bit of tweaking, you may like any of them in standard form so have a listen
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Nov 7, 2007 13:20:49 GMT
I have had both the OS and NOS. To my ears I find the sound of the NOS to be warmer and more tube like. I realize that some do not care for such a sound so at the end of hte day you will have to listen to both and see what you like.
I should have mentioned the Scott Nixon DAC. His dac is NOS but you can get it w/ a valve or solid state. Do a search on the passive mods for the Lite Dac-AH it is a very good sounding mod on an allready good sounding cheap dac. Good luck.
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Post by fault151 on Nov 7, 2007 18:49:31 GMT
thanks for your help guys. Id love to be able to hear a few but im not sure where i could do this. Iv contacted local dealers to see if they can arrange a few demos for me. I was also told by a music fidelity supplier that the xdac v3 has been discontinued? this true? If so would the best place to find one be ebay? I bet they don't even come up that often!
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Post by fault151 on Nov 7, 2007 18:56:24 GMT
PLEASE NOTE:
If anyone has a DAC for sale, please let me know. I may be interested!!!
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rickcr42
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Post by rickcr42 on Nov 7, 2007 21:17:11 GMT
I too have had both OS and NOS DACs and to be honest had credible performance from both once they were on equal terms with respect to the power source,chip decoupling,proper input termination and after dialing in the output stage. The NOS is more reminiscent of my analog rig but accurate it is not unless you call a top end rolloff in the audible range accurate-not that my old ears hear 20khz anyway ;D Dynamics shading top shelf.GRUNT factor slightly muted,music natural.Flows more than forced at you if that makes sense and the fit is a good one with older material (pre-CD remasters from analog master tapes) My OS DACs have full spectrum response flat from the sub bass to the anti-aliasing filter at 30k (pl;us some ultrasonic bumps ),separate individual notes better on balance but those notes seem more high-fi the natual-fi which means they kinda jump out instead of stay put.Very dramatic and with great grunt (low end slam). Sounds forced with my older cuts (things happen that overe the years of listening to those cuts just did not take place ). bottom line ? NOS for analog remasters and small format acoustic music OS for modern digital recordings and power rock seems to fit me just about right since the topology seems to play to the strengths of each . One size does not fit all BTW-one thing I can't do without no matter the format is having an inline audio transformer between the DAC output and the playback system analog input.One you here the total abscence of digital ground noise through galvanic isolation it is impossible to go back to straight in no matter if the DAC analog stage is SS or tubed or even totally passive Rickster out
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2007 21:59:31 GMT
Just like the man says ! He really knows what he is talking about ! ;D For those who have joined recently, Rickcr42 is the No.2 O.I.C., and the combined knowledge of Mike and Rick is something else again. They may not always agree, but hey, you won't get a much broader depth of information for free elsewhere. Again, great to see you back Rick. SandyK
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Post by dc on Nov 7, 2007 23:13:54 GMT
what's an in-line audio transformer?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2007 23:27:07 GMT
"BTW-one thing I can't do without no matter the format is having an inline audio transformer between the DAC output and the playback system analog input.One you here the total abscence of digital ground noise through galvanic isolation "
O.K. Rick, you have my undivided attention too. Presently I am investigating SMPS ground "noise" from DVD/CD players.
SandyK
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Nov 7, 2007 23:29:55 GMT
PLEASE NOTE: If anyone has a DAC for sale, please let me know. I may be interested!!! I have an X-Dac V3 w/ a Little Pinkie PSU. Mike how hard or easy is it to convert the Little Pinkie from US to British voltage/hertz? (assuming it is doable)
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FritzS
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Post by FritzS on Nov 8, 2007 4:49:38 GMT
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rowuk
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Post by rowuk on Nov 8, 2007 11:32:16 GMT
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mrarroyo
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Post by mrarroyo on Nov 8, 2007 18:24:09 GMT
Rick, where is a good place to obtain an isolation transformer in the USA? Thanks.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2007 21:00:42 GMT
Miguel In many cases there should be no advantage in using an isolating transformer. Use may even give a small reduction in overall SQ , most likely due to bandwidth reduction etc. I have only yesterday checked the output from different sources using SMPS supplies , right through the preamp at maximum gain , then into my Class A amplifier,using a CRO .Noise level was negligible, except on Oppo's analogue output and DTV STB. X-DACV3 had no problems,as did a Pioneer DV667A (SMPS). I traced the other low level hum/noise problems to an earthed antenna coaxial lead. Unplugging the antenna removed the problem. I will be fitting a ceramic capacitor (or 2) in series with the earth side of the antenna output to address the problem. In stubborn cases, Rick's method may well pay dividends.
If it aint broke, don't fix it !
SandyK
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