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Post by Ali on Feb 20, 2014 16:06:36 GMT
I am considering upgrading my HD650 cable from the stock cable and have been reading some good reviews on a few cables. Stephen Audio Endorphin or E series cable Moon Audio dragon
Any one have any views on these cables or know of any others I am running a modded xcan v2 with cheepo £20 qed interconnects ,wondering if upgrading these interconnects will help improve the sound also I was considering upgrading to the HD800 or gs1000 or even Audeze lcd2 if funds allow but I am not shure if the price is worth it or not
ps..anyone selling a little pinkie for a xcan v2 let me know
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Nigel
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Post by Nigel on Feb 21, 2014 23:08:11 GMT
When I had the Sennheiser HD600 I used the Cardas cable which I loved. I also used it with the HD650's but not so sure it was ideal in this combination. I use a Stefan Audio cable in my current headphone set up and I have a pair of AKG K501's with the same cable fitted. I should imagine far greater overall improvements could be had by purchasing the HD800's.
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Post by Ali on Feb 22, 2014 8:44:46 GMT
Thanks for the reply Nigel ..you could be right about trying a different headphone although I think I will hold onto the 650,s aswell
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Post by freddypipsqueek on Feb 22, 2014 17:06:30 GMT
Ali.
I have a couple of aftermarket cables for the HD580/600/660 etc, and I have done a DIY with the Cardas cable and overall would recommend the Stefan Audio Art cables. They are worth the money and occasionally come up second hand. I can't comment on the HD800 but at that level I can't see you would want to go back to the 600s and aftermarket cables are also available for those phones when you have the extra money.
You will notice a difference upgrading the interconnects but it is important before doing so to understand the sound you want to hear - many interconnects will tailor the sound according to the quality and nature of the materials being used. I would also (seriously) add that making your own cables (see HIFI Collective's site) is very easy and £50 in parts can easily out perform a retail cost of over £200.
Adrian.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 22, 2014 21:03:07 GMT
I must be the only person that really didn't hear much (if any) of a difference with aftermarket cables. Nigel, IIRC you gave me your old cardas cable (the blue one) and for the life of me I couldn't hear one iota of improvement. It certainly "looked" important but, having said that, was way too heavy for the sockets on the headphones... they are spring loaded and can become intermittent with the stock "light" cable, god only knows what the aftermarket python like cables will do to them over time. I agree with Adrian 100%, you're much better going down the DIY route (if you are fine with a soldering iron)it's a lot cheaper and the results will be much the same (nice looking thick cable but maybe only a placebo as to the perceived sonic improvement). With cables like this for £15 www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-Replacement-Audio-upgrade-Cable-For-Sennheiser-HD650-HD600-HD580-headphone-/281238052332 I, quite frankly, wouldn't waste money on anything more expensive and if you have a couple of hundred quid to throw at cabling that will leave you £185 for another pair of headphones....... they will certainly sound different to the HD-650 but instead of "just" having the HD-650 you'll now have two pairs of headphones to cycle, which is always good..... no one pair of headphones is a jack of all trades and it is always better to have a selection of different headphones than a selection of nice "looking" cables to hand.
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Post by Ali on Feb 24, 2014 14:10:09 GMT
Thanks for replys guys .a couple sets of headphones sounds the job
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alex30
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Post by alex30 on Mar 1, 2014 11:13:55 GMT
I must be the only person that really didn't hear much (if any) of a difference with aftermarket cables. Nigel, IIRC you gave me your old cardas cable (the blue one) and for the life of me I couldn't hear one iota of improvement. It certainly "looked" important but, having said that, was way too heavy for the sockets on the headphones... they are spring loaded and can become intermittent with the stock "light" cable, god only knows what the aftermarket python like cables will do to them over time. I agree with Adrian 100%, you're much better going down the DIY route (if you are fine with a soldering iron)it's a lot cheaper and the results will be much the same (nice looking thick cable but maybe only a placebo as to the perceived sonic improvement). With cables like this for £15 www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-Replacement-Audio-upgrade-Cable-For-Sennheiser-HD650-HD600-HD580-headphone-/281238052332 I, quite frankly, wouldn't waste money on anything more expensive and if you have a couple of hundred quid to throw at cabling that will leave you £185 for another pair of headphones....... they will certainly sound different to the HD-650 but instead of "just" having the HD-650 you'll now have two pairs of headphones to cycle, which is always good..... no one pair of headphones is a jack of all trades and it is always better to have a selection of different headphones than a selection of nice "looking" cables to hand. I agree 100% with you here. I have been fortunate in having various "Upgrade " cables at my disposal to try, including Cardas and did a blind test with a mate who swore he could hear loads of improvement. Needless to say he failed the test and so did I. I didn't hear any difference at all.
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Post by Ali on Mar 4, 2014 9:41:43 GMT
Placebo I think
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Post by stanga on Mar 4, 2014 17:06:23 GMT
I got a HD650 and a HD800. I would not advise anyone with a HD650 to expect the HD800 to sound better when used with the same headphone amp output that you are currently using. The bass and treble between them are at the opposite end of the satisfaction level. Realistically speaking, you'll need a completely different headamp performance for the HD800.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2014 23:06:01 GMT
I got a HD650 and a HD800. I would not advise anyone with a HD650 to expect the HD800 to sound better when used with the same headphone amp output that you are currently using. The bass and treble between them are at the opposite end of the satisfaction level. Realistically speaking, you'll need a completely different headamp performance for the HD800. The HD800 is best used with a HA that has a minimum of + and -20V supply rails, and preferably Class A. There are also quite a few reports that it sounds more balanced when driven from a 120 ohms source impedance too, even though it may not comply with the old IEC61938 directive.
Regards Alex
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Post by hellenback on Apr 25, 2014 1:13:44 GMT
Haven't been around or posted much on this forum but this thread caught my attention. I would love to believe that cables make no difference as it would cost much less and I'm not well off. However, some years ago a friend and I did some "close to blind" testing by using two pair of HD650s and a dual headphone out Perreaux SXH2 headphone amp. One pair had the stock cable, the other a Cardas. While one of us listened, the other would switch the listener's cans from behind while the listener kept his eyes closed. Without failure, both of us picked the Cardas every time as sounding better, ie a fuller all round sound, with deeper bass and more impact on things like the snare drum on Levon Helm's "Dirt Farmer" album. We didn't spend a whole lot of time testing as the difference was immediately obvious to both of us. However we did switch the cans/cables to be sure it wasn't the headphones as there can be some differences between different sets of the same model. Both were the silver diaphragm HD650s and the Cardas was easily distinguishable and sounded significantly better (and the same) with either pair. I've done quite a bit of cable comparing since then and have found differences in sound signature with different cables made of various materials. Some have made a noticeable improvement, others not so much. I have not done more relatively blind testing as the opportunity hasn't presented itself. I think it's significant that after some time using the Cardas and simply comparing it with other cables for the HD650s, it became apparent it wasn't the best cable for those particular cans. It's still a preferred cable for HD600s/580s but I've settled on a "Toxic silver poison" for the 650s. It's composed of pure silver with a touch of gold. I don't know why this combination of materials works so well, it just does. I have no affiliation with the company that makes the obnoxiously named "Poison" cable and frankly find the fan boy-ism on a certain forum a real turn off. I kind of wish the cable wasn't such a great match for the 650s but I've tried a few and it's the best I've heard. There are more expensive models from the same cable maker but I doubt the higher cost would create as significant an improvement in SQ. I c an hear a difference between cables but I can also determine when it's a case of diminishing returns. I buy used to avoid the high cost of a new aftermarket cable as the improvement usually isn't worth doubling the cost of your headphones. That said, if you like the basic sound signature of your cans and can get a good, compatible aftermarket cable for about half price, to my ears it can well be worth the investment.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2014 1:21:03 GMT
hellenback Did you try the same headphones and cables with different amplifiers ? Just because one may sound better with a specific amplifier doesn't necessarily mean that it will sound the best with all amplifiers.
Regards Alex
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Post by hellenback on Apr 25, 2014 1:23:24 GMT
Just with a portable Arrow as we had two of those...same results. If you read the whole post you should see I'm not that easily swayed. I have reconfirmed my findings over time and am happy with the improvements I've heard.
You'll also see I didn't say the Cardas sounded best except compared to the stock cable. I later found a better match for the 650s (and there might be better still, but I'm happy now).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2014 1:40:11 GMT
Hellenback
I am not doubting your results. I am just saying that one specific cable will not necessarily result in the same improvements with all amplifiers. In fact, any cable with a silver content is likely to cause an increase in perceived HF performance, which may result when used with some amplifiers as sounding a little too detailed, and perhaps even fatiguing for long term listening.
Regards Alex
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Post by hellenback on Apr 25, 2014 1:56:25 GMT
Hellenback
I am not doubting your results. I am just saying that one specific cable will not necessarily result in the same improvements with all amplifiers. In fact, any cable with a silver content is likely to cause an increase in perceived HF performance, which may result when used with some amplifiers as sounding a little too detailed, and perhaps even fatiguing for long term listening.
Regards Alex
I agree entirely. That's why I posted that I use the silver/gold cable with HD650s as they're warmer and less prominent in the high end thus seeming to benefit from that particular cable. I have tried silver cables I didn't like for their brightness and seeming lack of body/bass. With the HD600s I prefer the copper Cardas as it seems to fill them out a bit. My real point is that cables IMO can and do make a difference and I don't believe it is always placebo effect.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2014 2:04:40 GMT
Agreed ! And that applies to USB cables too.
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Post by hellenback on Apr 25, 2014 2:27:42 GMT
Agreed ! And that applies to USB cables too. I haven't experienced as much difference in the digital realm but I do use a USB cable with a well shielded power carrying section. I also go by a "shorter is better" rule whenever possible. I'm open to exploring any difference/improvement when I get the opportunity.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2014 3:14:36 GMT
Agreed ! And that applies to USB cables too. I haven't experienced as much difference in the digital realm but I do use a USB cable with a well shielded power carrying section. I also go by a "shorter is better" rule whenever possible. I'm open to exploring any difference/improvement when I get the opportunity. Hellenback The thread at the link may be of interest. The USB cable used has the +5V red wire disconnected at the USB-A plug at the PC end. When using the external PSU with a Corsair Voyager plugged in, further improvements were obtained by disconnecting the shield wire to the outgoing USB socket for the Corsair Voyager.( see photo) Many USB devices have the 0 volts black wire and the shield connected internally. When used with a PC that has a 3 pin IEC mains lead this results in an earth loop which degrades performance. I normally use a 1.8M length USB-A to USB-A cable that have been cut in half, and new solder type plugs fitted, to create 2 USB leads with the red +5V wire not terminated at the PC end. I fit some heatshrink over the new plugs. Regards Alex
rockgrotto.proboards.com/thread/7327/5v-linear-psu-usb-devices
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