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Post by PinkFloyd on Dec 16, 2006 13:25:04 GMT
Any recommendations for a good PSU kit/board/module? Here's a couple I've considered: www.tangentsoft.net/elec/teps/ - no complete kit. welbornelabs.com/psreg.htmI'd sooner buy a kit with all the parts or a completed module. To be honest I find sourcing all the components a bit of chore, in the UK at least, it invariably means buying from several suppliers and all those delivery charges rack up and it ends up more expensive than a complete kit or assembled module. The Welborne labs one looks good, not a bad price either. I hear you with regard to delivery charges, VAT etc. it's a pain in the arse.... a 20 pence capacitor ends up costing £8 by the time VAT and delivery are added. Fortunately I've got an account with RS so free delivery, unfortunately RS are the biggest bunch of robbers out there and seem to charge 4 times more than everyone else... unfortunately, the only place I can source Panasonic FM capacitors so the buggers have pretty much got the ball at their feet when it comes to charging.
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Dec 16, 2006 14:37:29 GMT
Hi Mike, Farnell also sell Panasonic FC and FM capacitors. They have a minimum order of £20.00, but delivery is free and they are generally slightly cheaper than RS. I like the look of the Wellbourne Labs regulator, it's nice and small, so I should be able to re-house the PSU and the amp board all in one case, which keeps everything tidy. What size transformer should I get for 24v? I was thinking either the 15VA 15V+15V 0.5A or the 30VA 15V+15V 1A from this range of encapsulated toroids at Rapid: www.rapidonline.com/productinfo.aspx?moduleno=72657. I would wire the secondaries in series to give me 30V AC into the voltage regulator.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Dec 16, 2006 15:18:45 GMT
Hi Mike, Farnell also sell Panasonic FC and FM capacitors. They have a minimum order of £20.00, but delivery is free and they are generally slightly cheaper than RS. I can't stand their search engine..... not enough time to mess about on that site looking for stuff. For sure. Either or xerxes, if you've got the room then the 30VA one.
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FritzS
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Post by FritzS on Dec 16, 2006 16:01:05 GMT
xerxes - I read about the "phoenix" MKII with interesting I only heared with LM6171 and AD-843 (my favorite) - in splitter are LM6171 - no ZOBEL, no input cap, but with C4 BlackGate NX 1000 uF 25V - more about: www.stockhammer.eu/hifi/wna.phpwww.blue-danube.at/Whats the difference between OPA627 and AD-843 in sound? Next time I will spend it a new PSU! I wait for the new NS LM4562 in single version (comes 2007) but three LM4562 I have for my CD player: www.stockhammer.eu/hifi/cd650.php
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rickcr42
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 16, 2006 17:11:46 GMT
The 843 has more slam in the lower octaves
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FritzS
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Post by FritzS on Dec 17, 2006 11:59:21 GMT
sidestep offtopic :-) now my Ph.CD 650 runs with NS LM4562 but I hear no significant differences between it an the OP275.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Dec 17, 2006 20:10:29 GMT
sidestep offtopic :-) now my Ph.CD 650 runs with NS LM4562 but I hear no significant differences between it an the OP275. OP275 is a lovely sounding chip Fritz, particularly nice in some CD players, if there's little or no difference between it and the LM4562 that says a lot for the LM4562. How long have you had it running?
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FritzS
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Post by FritzS on Dec 18, 2006 9:29:20 GMT
~ one hour, I think the modifications are the optimum what the DAC TDA1541P can do - to compare exact we must use a new DAC and/or a very good SACD or a top analog turntable - plus a ABX blind test.
I wait impatient for the single OP version from the LM4562 - coming beginning 2007 - for test in my WNA MKII
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Post by PinkFloyd on Dec 18, 2006 20:55:28 GMT
I wait impatient for the single OP version from the LM4562 - coming beginning 2007 - for test in my WNA MKII Yeh, it'll be interesting to see what effect it has in the WNA. I'll try it too, hope it's early in the New Year
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Dec 21, 2006 7:03:42 GMT
A little update: In case you've been wondering where I've been for a few days, I've moved house. Good: I have finished all the heavy lifting. Bad: I haven't finished unpacking everything yet. Good: After a great deal of palaver and shouting at call centre staff and technical support operatives the phone line, with the same number has been transfered to my new address. Pipex Homecall really are feckin' useless, fine while everything is working, but when something "tricky", like moving address comes up, they really don't know their arse from their elbow. Bad: It's going to be about three weeks until broadband is enabled at my new address. Another result of Pipex's missinformation and incompetence. Good: A friend I've known for 20 years or so lives right opposite me and has a WiFi wireless router doohickey and having purchased a wireless doodad for my PC I can connect to the interweb through her WiFi router. Which is much better than dial-up. Bad: My Hi-Fi sounds different in it's new location and I think I prefer how it sounded previously. Maybe I just need to get accustomed to it. Good: The AD843s are on their way. Bad: They will take up to 8 weeks to arrive - I was unnaware that they are manufactured on the outskirts of the solar system.
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rickcr42
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 21, 2006 18:36:49 GMT
Dial in the room.Stand in it and clap your hands then listen to both the initial sound and how long the sound lingers
too dull ? Add some reflective surfaces,remove/change "fluffy" furniture like removing big throw pillows from sofas/chairs and maybe openng cutains to get some "glass bounce"
too bright ? add some absorptive material about 1/3 the way between the speakers and your listening position then do the reverse of the above until you tame the room. Diffusors are great with the cheapest ones I know of being book cases along the long walls with the shelves not totally filled but filled with alternating spaces/fillings in a random pattern (no two shelves identical).
works fine and looks good without looking like an audio specific piece.
remember owen you can change the character of any room with a few basic fixes
1-Any hard flat surface will reflect sound 2-all soft surfaces abosorb sound to some extant,some in a very narrow band ,some pretty much across the spectrum,some a lot,some a little 3-any surface that has multiple opposing angles will disperse sound in a random pattern (diffusors)
the last group are the room lens diffusors which are open pipes and the tunes wood box cavity types.These are more to get a "room tone" than for controlling any actual problem areas.See Michael Green products for details on the technology then make your own and do google "room lens" for plans to that room tuner.
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Dec 22, 2006 9:08:01 GMT
Hi Rick, I'm aware of the basic "live or dead" characteristics of a room and how hard and soft objects and clutter can effect this. The new room is a little more live than the old one, but I think the big problem is that it is a fair bit larger in volume. The old room was about 3m x 3m, with a 2.6 metre high ceiling, that's 9' x 9' x 8' in old money. The new room is about 3.5 m x 4.5 m with a 4m high ceiling, 10.5' x 13.5' and 12' high. In the old room, my little Dynaudio Speakers had no trouble filling the space, but in the new room I think they're struggling. Whereas the sound used to be big, weighty and generous, almost too much with some recordings, it's now compararively thin and lightweight, it's as if the speakers just can't move enough air with their little 6.5 inch woofers to generate enough bass, and the punch, that you could feel in your chest, is no longer there.
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rickcr42
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 22, 2006 11:47:24 GMT
ah,different fish fry entirely To get more bass you would normally try to get speakers closer to or actually IN the corners but this brings another set of problems 1-hole in the middle possibly requiring a L/R blend control to close them up more 2-early reflections from the walls playing hell with the image and speaker smoothness requiring you to just about totally deaden the walls with acoustic panels but this eats acoustic power that many times when you try to make it up in amp power leads to clipping or overdriven speakers so your only real options are to sit closer or add a subwoofer to handle the bottom octaves.Unfortunately you can't break the laws of physics so expecting a small woofer to move enough air to create true low notes in a large room while listening at a distance is not going to happen without stacking bass cabinets thus creating more woofer cone area so either you move closer to the sound,something that is free but can play hell with your decor/WAF or you have to assist the point source bass with corner/floor reinforcement or a bigger/more cone are maybe a simple open baffle sub in a corner
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Dec 22, 2006 16:21:59 GMT
Hi Rick, I've moved the speakers in, out, backwards, forwards, but no matter where I put them, I just can't find the lost "welly". I don't really want to go down the subwoofer route, before I went down that road, I would look at buying a bigger set of speakers that have more cone area to start with. I like(d) my Dynaudios, so perhaps I could start by looking at some of their bigger brothers.
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rickcr42
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 22, 2006 16:57:07 GMT
subs are/can be a real pain and why I am currently without one having zero luck finding one I both like and that will FIT the room all those I am looking at being huge horn loaded gorillas (though I do have those JBL B480 plans lurking in the background calling rick....rick....rick........ ) sub less maybe something with 8 inchers for the mid-woofer would work in your room.Still compact but move a lot more air
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Post by PinkFloyd on Dec 22, 2006 19:30:51 GMT
www.rel.net/ stuff one of those somewhere in the room (better still stuff a couple)
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Dec 22, 2006 19:39:27 GMT
I don't think a sub is the answer, it's not just the low, rumbly, trouser flapping stuff that's missing, or at least somewhat reduced, it's also the upper bass "thump", which I think needs to come from the main speakers in order to preserve the stereo image.
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rickcr42
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 22, 2006 20:03:24 GMT
pretty muc the rule of thumb is if your XO is below 70 or so Hz you can place the sub anywhere and have it be usable but go above that and you either need to place the sub perfectly in between and along the same plane as the minis or go to dual subs placed right at the speakers or you will get a disconnect.
I always go to 60-70 Hhz as the Low Pass XO on the subs which have their own amps then use the full rangers with no rolloff so can usully get away with murder on placement the subs handling the very narrow range of 30ish Hz to at most 70 Hz so non directional though what t does to timing is anybodies guess
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Dec 22, 2006 21:22:22 GMT
I must admit that I've never actually tried a sub, but I can't help thinking that a pair of speakers that don't need a sub to "fill in" have to be a better option in the long run. I don't use the hi-fi for movies, just music, so I'm not interested in reproducing the rumblings of trains, explosions etc. When I do watch movies they tend not to be of the crash, bang, wallop, Holywood blockbuster, action variety in any case.
In addition, adding a single decent sub to my set up may not work out much cheaper than selling my existing speakers and stands and replacing them with a larger pair of floor standing speakers with more room filling ability.
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rickcr42
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Post by rickcr42 on Dec 22, 2006 23:59:19 GMT
simple physics man.A large space needs the piston to move more air and if unassisted by even the simplest small speaker assist-walls close by-you usually have no shot. Ways i know of to get true low bass from a small cone are 1-multile drivers that in the accumulative add to to a larger cone 2-huge X-Max driver combined with electronic EQ assistance 3-Horn loading,low X-Max driver since actua excursion is small 4-A HUGE cabinet,can be transmission line terminated or infinite baffle 5-Bandpass loading,subs only due to a very narrow range of freqs being reproduced the only way to get there with a small driver/small box type speaker is the subwoofer and if your minis have the mid bass hump you need to bang that sucker down using a single pole high pass filter (inline cap) to it rolls off smoothly then have a powered sun with a high rolloff kick in where the two overlap. again this will likely be a high crossover point so if a single sub it needs to be dead nuts centered on the left and right mains plus for best response in an ideal system with the box on the same vertical plane as the mains or the illusion of a single system will fall apart.If that can not be done then it is stereo subs which can get pricey but does have the advantage of performing double duty as both woofer and speaker stand as long as you spike the minis to the top (cones).Also allows you to move the top mounted minis forward or back for best phase response or even to angle them up or in as the need be. the hard part is getting GOOD bass not plentiful bass so usually not cheap unless you DIY. check this baby out for instance.nice design plus being an O.B. (open baffle) should blend well with damn near any speaker withing its same sensitivity range www.linkwitzlab.com/woofer.htm
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FritzS
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Post by FritzS on Dec 25, 2006 11:47:06 GMT
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Feb 21, 2007 1:50:04 GMT
In case anyone was wondering what happened with my WNA upgrade/modifications, here's the finished article: I used a 30VA 12v - 12v transformer wired in series to give me 24v AC at 0.625A, supplying the Welborne labs PSREG configured for 24v, 23.2 in reality. For good measure I included a dual stage chassis filter on the mains input. I currently have 3 x AD843s in place and it sound pretty darn good. The only worry is that the heatsink on the PSREG gets pretty hot, too hot to touch. How hot is safe?
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 21, 2007 11:43:33 GMT
Beautiful job Xerxes, all in the one enclosure too.... excellent. As to the heat, it will run very hot which is why there are heatsinks strapped on.... if you touch with your index finger how long (in seconds) before you go "ouch!" ?
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xerxes
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Post by xerxes on Feb 21, 2007 13:48:53 GMT
Pretty much as soon as you touch it. With the power off it quickly cools, showing that the heatsink is doing its job. You can see that I've made a row of holes in the rear of the case and there are some holes in the base of the amp with 10mm high feet to leave an air gap under the amp, so there should be some airflow through the case: However, I'm worried about using the amp for long periods, which kind of defeats the purpose of using a mains power supply.
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Post by PinkFloyd on Feb 21, 2007 16:04:05 GMT
I wouldn't worry xerxes, if you think that's hot you wanna feel the resistors in my DarkVoice amp they would remove flesh in 3 seconds if you touched them, what is the actual part number? We can check the data sheet and see what the max operating temperature is.
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