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Post by helidan on May 24, 2012 16:48:15 GMT
Hi guys, my first post on these forums!!
Recently I got my feet wet with tube amps, purchased a Bravo from ebay (revised edition with EH 6922 tube) and after a good few hours listening was quite surprised what a tube can do for the music. In the past I had read about certain advantages tubes have over solid state but until quite recently had not really experienced it.
As good as the Bravo is especially considering the price I cannot help but feel you can do a fair bit better, people seem to be modding these little amps left right and center to try and obtain a better sound.
After trawling the net and reading all sorts of forums I have a keen interest in both the Little Dot MK3 and the Project Sunrise 2.
How would these amps compare to the Bravo and how would they compare to each other?
My headphones of choice are ATH-M50's, music source is a Xonar Essence STX soundcard. I listen to a variety of styles, (rock, RnB, trance, rap, dance/club).
Appreciate any info you guys can give me!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2012 18:53:48 GMT
Hi Helidan,
Welcome to RG.
The ATH-M50 is 38 Ohm. So you will be best off with an amplifier that can properly drive these low Ohmic headphones.
The little Dot mk3 is rated for 32 to 600 Ohm but because it is an all tube OTL (output Transformer Less) design with a tube output stage it is more suited for headphones between 120 and 600 Ohms. In 32 Ohm it only manages 100mW which is reasonably loud but with little reserve. Another thing is the low frequency cutoff point (-3dB) is around 20Hz which means the lows start to roll off already around 60hz which is audible. What's even more troubling is the phase shifs one gets in the lows because of it.
So little Dot mk3 is not very suited for the M50.
IF you want to stay with Little Dot I would recommend the little Dot I+ This one is designed for low Ohmic headphones and will be able to reach 800mW. This means 9dB more power ! It reaches 10HZ - 50KHz (-3 dB) and thus there is less phase shift as with the mk3.
The project Sunrise-II can reach 900mW which is essentially the same power as Dot I+ frequency range is a bit wider still so even less phase shifts -3dB: 4Hz - 350kHz (32 Ohm) It also has the benefit of having 2 output resistances you can select and tube rolling is easy.
Also the HA10 is an option and is basically similar to Sunrise except for looks and pricing if you want POWERRRRRR the Hifiman EF-5. This last one can blow your headphones to smithereens though (like the Schiit amps)
All these amps are considerable 'better' than the Bravo yet share a same trait... a non-fedback triode amplifier with hybrid (solid state) output and all fed with low power supply voltages (except for mk3 which is high voltage). The SQ off all is mostly dependent on the used tube and how much harmonics it adds.
Price. looks, availability, ease of use and service may also be deciding factors.
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Post by helidan on May 25, 2012 6:17:28 GMT
solderdude, thank you for the very informative post!
So it would seem like the PS2 would be my best option if I'm going to continue using my current ATH M50s, if I'm honest I do prefer the look of the Sunrise over the LD!! I did have a look at that Hifiman EF-5 you mentioned, my word that thing has some grunt!! not sure I require that much power!
As I'm new to tubes and in reference to my first post what tube do you think would best suit the music styles I mentioned? I appreciate it's a very subjective thing but from what I've read the Sunrise encourages experimentation with quite a large variety of tubes.
I'll prob order a Sunrise very soon, more than likely the kit version but I wouldn't mind having a small selection of tubes to try in order to get the particular sound I desire.
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XTRProf
Fully Modded
Pssst ! Got any spare capacitors ?
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Post by XTRProf on May 25, 2012 6:50:41 GMT
Don't forget the MF V2 at 1.3W too which many own here at RG as amongst the top of the list favourite HA to be with and for keep. I own one now after all high praises for it. Fully moded, it will give many HAs a run for the money. I have just compared my modified Balanced Class D HA with the MF V2 and that MF is still sounding good overall irregardless of the latest "high tech" image the class D amps have accumulated over the years.
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Post by helidan on May 27, 2012 12:17:55 GMT
Don't forget the MF V2 at 1.3W too which many own here at RG as amongst the top of the list favourite HA to be with and for keep. I own one now after all high praises for it. Fully moded, it will give many HAs a run for the money. I have just compared my modified Balanced Class D HA with the MF V2 and that MF is still sounding good overall irregardless of the latest "high tech" image the class D amps have accumulated over the years. Certainly a promising looking amp with very good specs, but would only be available to buy second hand correct?? TBH I still much prefer to actually see the little glass bottle so it's still very likely I'll end up purchasing a PS2, I like the fact that you can try so many different tubes with it. ps what is the physical size of the Sunrise?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2012 22:00:12 GMT
13cm wide, 15cm deep, height 6 (without tube, measured to top of capacitors)
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XTRProf
Fully Modded
Pssst ! Got any spare capacitors ?
Posts: 5,689
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Post by XTRProf on May 27, 2012 22:00:41 GMT
Certainly a promising looking amp with very good specs, but would only be available to buy second hand correct?? Correct! TBH I still much prefer to actually see the little glass bottle so it's still very likely I'll end up purchasing a PS2, I like the fact that you can try so many different tubes with it. ps what is the physical size of the Sunrise? Actually, looking nice is one thing and I also personally like that look. But being exposed also brings about more RFI and EMI then being screened in thru encasing. How bad is the problem, that I can't say as I don't own a PS. For your thought. Objectively or subjectively quieter? Only those PS owners can say further. One thing for sure is that technically, the PS is much better than any other copies of that topology from the likes of Bravo, Indeed, etc .............. Size wise should be slightly bigger than your palm.
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