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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 27, 2011 8:44:49 GMT
That video is so funny Ian
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2011 14:13:40 GMT
Well, it's not until you try a single blade that you realise how hard it is to get them up into the sky and under control. My Blade MSR arrived today. Very fast. A totally different flyer to the MCX2. Doesn't feel as stable and you have to continuously compensate for drif. not only that, if you send it forwards, it won't suddenly stop like the coaxials. You have to compensate by going back on the stick to stop it. I'd be very careful with a three foot single blade, Mike. A tiny one is a killer so I dread to think what you could do with such a big heli. I wanted speed, and now I've got it. The MSR is on something in comparison to the MCX2. If you dare push the thing forward, it really shoots off. I'm not taking this outside until I have a good grip of it. It could end up a long way away and very difficult to get back. I can also see that it would fight wind currents a lot better too. I'll fight with this for a while and maybe move to 120 SR but only after I've got a grip of this little angry bee. Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 27, 2011 19:32:37 GMT
Glad you like the MSR Ian.... I find the MCX2 fast enough for my needs and generally just do a bit of sedate hovering outdoors. The carbon fibre tail booms arrived today and they are awful! The entire helicopter vibrates badly with them fitted (tried both of them).... I phoned up RC choppers..... "first time we have heard about this, it's unusual" I told them that there were many people reorting this problem on the net...... "we don't read that rubbish on the internet, they don't know what they are talking about"..... What a condescending prick! I suggested maybe it was time he STARTED having a read about these vibration problems and he said he would look into it. Put the old canopy on again and she flew as smooth as silk. I have come to the conclusion that I like the MCX2 for it's easy flying abilities but absolutely detest a few aspects of the design too.... I don't like the way the battery can overshoot the cradle and make contact with the cog, I don't like the flimsy plastic (would rather have aluminium for that kind of money).... I'm frightened I break it every time I change the battery and that canopy is quite easily broken too..... I hit a wall a few days ago and a piece of plastic just fell out of the side so now it has a hole in one side Of course, the secret is NOT to crash into walls but I just feel the overall quality of materials could be improved. The tail booms are a joke, unless you want to turn your MCX2 into an unstable vibrating type thing.... I'll send one of the booms over to you Ian, see if you can replicate the instability. Have you crashed the MSR yet? I'll maybe get one when I'm feeling a bit more racey
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2011 21:59:47 GMT
I have come to the conclusion that I like the MCX2 for it's easy flying abilities but absolutely detest a few aspects of the design too.... I don't like the way the battery can overshoot the cradle and make contact with the cog, I don't like the flimsy plastic (would rather have aluminium for that kind of money).... I'm frightened I break it every time I change the battery and that canopy is quite easily broken too..... I hit a wall a few days ago and a piece of plastic just fell out of the side so now it has a hole in one side
The battery overshoot is a bit daft on the MCX. You don't get that with the MSR. You have to be really careful of that.
The plastic is to make sure that it's light enough to fly without eating the battery away. Also, because it's kind of mallible, it doesn't suffer (strangely enough) as much as a metal copter in crashes. It's so light that most little crashes don't do too much to it. Biggies are another matter, but that's the same with metal. I pranged a medium sized metal heli a while ago now and it was bent so it never flew again.
I dread to think how slow the MCX would be if it were made in metal. It's slow enough already!!
I would like to have seen the windows open, so air could move through them and a wire boom that balances so that it's not quite as crazy outside. If the wind could perhaps blow through it, it might react less.
I have two MCx's - one I fly indorrs and is pristine. The other, I use outside in case of wind crashes etc so I can play around with a relatively cheap heli in difficult conditions. It's just more of a challenge and btw - closer to the Blade flying as well!!
I've had a good fly with the MSR now. No crashes yet, but it slips about like it's on ice. You have to continually adjust for it and it doesn't just stop like the mCx2. If you want to improve on the MCx, go to the MSR and then back and you feel that it SO easy and there isn't really that much of a challenge with it.
I tend to be very careful with them when I haven't flown them so I go through the stages of hover/left right, forward back, turns etc before I actually let it go. That way, you avoid prangs.
The MSR slips all over the place, rather like it's balanced on the top of a ball and it has a tendency to go into 'pendulum' swings if you hover after forward flight. That's a pain in the arse. Fast forward flight is followed by a backward 'swing' so you have to put a little twitch in the joystick to counteract that.
Take offs are also a bit hairy in that they tend to veer off to the left (Like all single blades). Then when you send it up and it goes into a pendulum, then you're in trouble controlling it. It seems to go up better if you throttle up hard and then let go at the top. The copter stops and because you've let the power of, the slight drop that you get stops the pendulum so at least you can start flying from relatively still.
When you first fly one, you start to wonder how on earth anyone can control them, but after a couple of hours, it starts to get under control more and I'm now flying in circles, but slowly. I haven't the nerve to send it off/away from me too far because it's so fast, you could lose it easily.
It goes up fine and I land it but in between, it's a hairy journey. I've improved but I am nervous of letting rip because this is a fast heli. It goes off like a rocket. LIke an MCx on steroids basically.
For instance, it was 15 feet away from me, a bit near a curtain, so I turned it and gave it a lot of forward throttle. It literally shot away from the curtain and I caught it in a split second. It's unbelievably fast.
Great fun but much more difficult to fly than the MCX2. I also think it's more hairy than big 'uns. They're more stable because of the weight. This slips and slides all over the place.
It's a real flight education!!!
Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 29, 2011 19:03:04 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Sept 29, 2011 19:22:38 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2011 20:39:55 GMT
They're similar to the Bladez types. Extremely stable to fly. The worst part is the battery. If you're not careful with those stuck in packs that they put in them, they can give out, so it's best not to take it to the bottom of the charge.
They're so weak that if you give the heli a burst when they're close to their lowest voltage, they go past the point of no return and won't charge again. The number of times I've replaced the damned things!!!
Best to have some kind of timer and stop flying at six and a half to seven minutes. That way, the battery is safer.
The MSR is like you're flying a racing car. I'm getting more control of it now, but it's taking time. They're a bit fast in a normal front room so I'd be surprised if people didn't smack them badly within the first few minutes.
All single blades veer of left on take off so you have to compensate and suddenly let go when it's airborn; let alone try to keep it still in the air. If you dare touch the forward tilt or throttle, it goes off like a jet plane.
I think it's a bit too fast for your normal sized room. I can see it working better outside with more space. It'll also fight the breeze better.
It's a good heli but needs a lot of patience. I'm nearly there, but even a 28 foot front room feels small for it.
Are you getting that massive thing? If you are, be careful. It'll behave like the MSR except it's 3 feet and so heavier to drop. (It'll break easier) Also it'll kill a sheep for Christmas!!
Also, have you got the MCX2 to behave. Perhaps better to get another back part. Not too expensive. Or ...... go MSR and go to the loo before you fly it!!!!
Ian
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2011 22:08:06 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 1, 2011 9:11:21 GMT
That was a bit hair raising..... very calm morning here so I thought I'd take the MCX2 outside for a spin.... I fired her up into the air (quite high) and she started to drift away from me over an adjacent field I had to climb over (into the field) whilst still trying to control the helicopter... it seemed to be getting higher and higher.... once in the field I gradually bought her down from the sky but she seemed to be stuck in some type of air current and was travelling away from me all the time..... managed to get her down and ran over and "caught" her..... phew, I won't be doing that again in a hurry! It was really cool watching her go up high but VERY difficult to control once it was up there! erm, I think I'll stick to "indoors" and definitely WON'T be buying one of those three foot long things
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2011 12:20:23 GMT
It is a bit hairy when a breeze catches the mcx2. Best thing to do is make the heli face the wind with full forward throttle. Then cut the power suddenly and rev up again. The heli drops and kind of nose dives into the wind and that gives it an extra burst of speed when you rev up again to fight it!.
To be honest, Mike, that's the next step. You'll find indoor dead easy now by comparison. Next big step is the msr. Then you really learn flying. It skates around and you really have to get a grip of it. You learn to go with natural flight tendencies and use them to your advantage while flying. For instance, the msr and the 120 sr tend to do what is called a 'pendulum' effect. Some would try and fight with it, but if it pendulums forwards, then take the forward throttle off and then push forward at the point where the heli will swing back. That way, she flies smooth. You also learn to just touch the controls lightly or it goes off like a rocket. Take offs and landings are also difficult cos it tends to go off left. That's normal for a single blade so you have to compensate for a split second.
I took the msr outside for a fly this morning. It fights the breeze a bit better than mcx2 which is very slow by comparison.
It's worth learning the msr, Mike, if you want to progress more in your flying. It's best to learn in a big hall. You would crash for sure in a small area. Once you have it under control, then try a smaller room for control work and then take it out in readiness for the 120 or honey bee.
The nice thing is the msr can be bought just as a heli with nothing else so it's a cheaper upgrade from mcx2. Remote and batteries are the same.
Msr is a cracker but very frustrating at first to get off the ground safely and back. It makes the mcx2 seem very tame.
Sorry if there is any bad typos. I'm not at home so typing on a phone.
Ian
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2011 13:36:30 GMT
BTW - another useful thing to do is use the 4 rubber rings supplied as spares on the skids. It stops the heli skidding about on take off. More important with the msr than with the mcx2 but gives a beautiful smooth take off. Well worth it.
Ian
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2011 15:47:04 GMT
Dave, that's a strange little green heli there!! They're more aimed at kids 'cos they're safer to fly and very slow. Also won't work outside because they're infa red.As soon as the sun comes out, you kiss good bye to your heli!!! I did that in Guernsey when mine became a submarine, 12 foot underwater in the swimming pool!!
The MCX2 is a tad better cos it's 4 channel which means that it moves in more directions and it's more like the real thing. Mind you, the MSR is like a racing car in the air. It seriously moves and can be a bit intimidating if you're flying it. It behaves a bit more like a real helicopter, but the movements are exaggerated because it's small and the air molecules are 'life' size. Now if we could shrink the air molecules, they'd fly exactly like the real thing!!
I'm working towards a big one. If that drops, the cars below would know about it!!
Maybe we should encourage a few RG people to get a 'copter and Mike and I could try and give 'flying' lessons!!!
We could progress from the little toy ones up to the bigger ones.
A bit different from headphones though. However, once you start, you won't stop until you master it. It's a bit like riding a bike and is really hard to control the balance of the heli when you start!!!
It gets you out into the fresh air as well!!!
Ian
Ian
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2011 18:03:30 GMT
My First MSR Stunt!! Mike, I took it up outside this afternoon. No wind at all. So, I sent it up and up until it was a little dot up there and I couldn't hear it. Beautiful, went up slowly, in control and straight as well. I was SO pleased. It looked like a real heli up there. It hovered beautifully at one helluva height so after a while, I thought I'd better move it so..... Tiny forward thrust and off it went. Nice and smooth then the stunt ........... I turned left and banked at the same time (like I do on the MCX2) and the MSR went beserk. It veered over at 45 degrees and went into a half dive at what I reckon was about 30mph!!!!!! There was no way to stop it and it was coming down fast at an angle, so I eased right off the forward and let it use its own motion and heaved on the power big time. It started to level and was coming for the ground and at the last minute, I fave it a load of forward thrust again and it tilted back up and shot up again!! When it got to the top, it stopped so I did waht I normally do, and let the forward off for a split second and then pushed forward slowly again to stop the pendulum effect. After that, I brought it verically down in very slow motion, I can tell you. I reckon on full whack, this thing does 15MPH on the flat but up in the sky and a bit of banking, it's a bloody mad machine!! I dread to think what speed the 120 sr goes at, but this is a speed monster. I couldn't believe what it did....... I then crept indoors and flew it in the front room, still shaking!!! Just shows you the difference between a coaxial type and a Single rotor. This is one of the fastest I've tried for its size. I wish I'd filmed it now. (Total accident, but looked good!!) Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 1, 2011 19:53:45 GMT
Ian, don't you think the larger helicopters would fly better outdoors? These little blades go mental if a puff of wind hits them (specially if they are up high).... I got quite a fright this morning when it was up in the sky and moving away from me No way would I take one out when it was gusting 95mph winds.... I'd never see it again! Some kid in Iceland would find it in his back garden. I LOVE the idea of being able to use the same batteries and controller as the MCX2 but (for indoor use) think I would smash the MSR to bits as it may be a bit "too" fast. I am still, occasionally, crashing the MCX2.... I take her into tight spots and tend to panic with the resultant "snap, crackle, pop" off the wall An MSR would be learning to run before I could walk (for me) and, for indoor use, I find the MCX2 fast enough..... no way would it be practical up here for outdoor use as I live right next to the sea and the wind from the Atlantic Ocean is always there or thereabouts. I really would need a tank like helicopter for outdoor use up here.... something the size of a Nissan Micra.... and something with plenty of "grunt" to chop through the wind. The little one (the £14.99 jobby) is quite good fun indoors! I call her the Mini Mongoose..... she will go off course if you even breathe in her general direction and would simply "disappear" (never to be seen again) if I let her fly outdoors Those fixed batteries ARE a pain in the arse..... it runs out and you have to wait 30 minutes to get her airborn again.... very robust little bastards tho' you could whack them with a hammer and they'd still fly.... great for "desktop" use, plug into the USB port of the computer, when charged have a fly.... plug her back in and recharge..... a very good buy @ £15 and very nicely built too. I see "Linda" is now modelling a Double Horse 3 channel copter (why doesn't she model them wearing "only" stockings.... it would give us a better under the hood view of Linda....) She seems pleased with the "Double Horse" (more satisfying than a single horse I presume).... good length to it for the money www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DOUBLE-HORSE-9053-VOLITATION-R-C-HELI-EASY-FLY-/250831644586?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item3a66bb27aa
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2011 21:48:47 GMT
The coaxials seem to find breezes tough, even the big ones:
I think the area between the two sets of blades acts as a kind of sail so they get blown everywhere. I quite like that double bladed thing though - more relaxing to fly than a single.
The MSR is unbelievably fast. Outside, it can get away from you in a second. It also shoots up into the sky like a rocket if you give it some welly.
Indoors, you just touch it or you're totally out of control. In fact, low power on the transmitter is still pretty quick. I dread to think what it does when you change the swashplate.
My outdoor MCX2 has the swashplate set high so it stands a slightly better chance. I think we get less wind down here so it's more possible to fly outdoors.
Today, it was totally flat and I sent the MSR a really long way up. I could barely see it. I'm lucky 'cos there's a lot of space that's grassed so it's not too scary. You have to concentrate with the MSR though since it's also very light and could easily go for a fly to France.
Those little USB ones fly nicely, but the battery thing is a pain. Also, the batteries aren't that robust so they pack in after a while and you end up having to get another one and stick it in the canopy with double sided sticky tape. (That's how they normally sit in there on a lip) They do fly sedately though.
Once you've flown and MSR (or a big 'un) then the MCX2 is a little pussy cat and extremely stable in comparison.
The MSR just feels wild. I suspect the 120 is more stable with more weight, but I hear that the batteries are crap. (and there's no equivalent yet) That's a pity.
Not sure whether I'll go Honey bee or 120 sr yet. Got to get a real grip of the MSR first.
If I'm honest, the MSR isn't like other single blades I've tried. It has a strong stabiliser system (what a joke) that is supposed to help you keep it hovering, but it causes the pendulum which you adjust for eventually. Once you learn its characteristics and use them to help you fly, it's ok. Your natural tendency is to fight against its characteristics, but once you go with it, it becomes more friendly.
The speeding episode today caught me very unaware and I've never had one go off at that speed before.
Have a look at this ..... the same heli and what can so easily happen; even with a big 'un:
Are you still using a wire boom on the MCX2, Mike?
Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 1, 2011 22:33:01 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2011 7:38:21 GMT
It looks fantastic, Mike. It'll be hard to hold stll because what the guys selling call 'stable' is really mental. The heli runs rings around you and you see these comments about how well they hover!!
The MSR gave me a bit of a surprise yesterday with it's speed and it's tiny in comparison to that. I dread to think how fast that could get away from you.
I'm not sure how 6 channels are used. Maybe the two extra include 'rolling' and 'flips'?. I'd keep away from them for a while!!
That's going to be a lot of fun. Plus 10 minutes flying time. It has a big battery. That one is a case of 'private rehearsal'. I suspect it's a bugger to get off the ground. Strong left pull on take off so it'll need a flick to send it right just as you power up. The MSR is the same.
Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2011 8:52:34 GMT
You appear to also trim it with a screwdriver... have a look at this (it flies upside down!)
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2011 8:56:59 GMT
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2011 9:30:46 GMT
By the look of it I'll have to fit the training kit at first..... I don't think these are "plug 'n fly" type things
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2011 11:58:13 GMT
The training kit is a good idea for your first single blade, Mike. Honestly, on the first day of flying, you'll think your heli has a fault. It's like being on ice in 3d. It'll skate all over the place. Just be sure to do tiny joystick corrections or else it'll go off like a rocket. The only time you need a burst is getting off the ground.
Rev up to the point where it start to want to lift and the give a burst combined with right aileron and quickly let go of the aileron the second it leaves the ground. That's really worth practising and then getting it down smoothly. The heli will have a natural tendency to swing left on take off and that's normal, believe it or not!
The beginners kit makes it behave in a strange way though as well. When you take the kit off, you send it up like a rocket because you'll be used to the extra weight.
You also have to try and resist anything fancy. It's really hard. One mistake and you'll need a trip to Norway or it'll crash big time with the weight. Even worse on a car or house!!!
You'll be gagging for good weather.
Is your mcx2 behaving now?
Ian
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2011 12:38:18 GMT
MCX2 is fine now I have the original canopy back on... those tail booms are a joke.. Sam was going on about balancing the blades etc. but I'd rather stick with the stock canopy. Is there no way you can plug your transmitter into the computer and get used to it by doing a flight simulation type thing? That would be great if the Honey Bee came with something like that.... get used to flying the Honey Bee on the computer and THEN take it for a spin. Wooden blades on this thing and not sure if they would survive a head on collision with a wall so I'll have to be very careful with it, at first.... as you say, I will practice landing and take off for a week or so before even attempting to fly it round the room... it's a fair bit bigger than the MCX2 but not as big as the one Linda models (ooooh Linda! )..... the only way I'll have it flying "upside down" is if I press the wrong button.... would like to try a loop the loop tho'
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2011 12:46:27 GMT
More Honey Bee: This guy is good!
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2011 12:58:00 GMT
HOLY CRAP!!!
How on earth can he do that?!!
Amazing!
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Post by PinkFloyd on Oct 2, 2011 13:12:23 GMT
Oh,,, I say
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