Will
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Post by Will on Jan 25, 2011 21:46:40 GMT
I've wanted to design and make my own dac for a while, purely because I'm not clever enough at analogue electronics to design something useful. The ess 9022 sabre dac was released last year, and being cheap (about a £1) to buy, and having an audio out, I thought it looked nice and simple to start with. The only drawback is that it only accepted an I2S signal, and I only have spdif easily available. So I also had to figure out how to use a spdif transceiver. I chose the Wolfson WM8804 chip, as it seems a good spec, relatively cheap and also uses the same supply voltage as the dac chip (3.3 Volts). I also figured that I would configure the receiver to accept up to 24/192 signals, so that I could use it with my SC Dac. Well, I built up the first one, and got crackles, which was a bit of a bugger, but after changing the wm8804 for a new one, the dac works. I've just got it going, and it's working well from my cd player. The output of the dac easily powers my philips test headphones at quite a good level, and the test cd of Master of Puppets, by Metallica, is really sounding quite nice. There's a few more things I want to try, including integral volco, and a seperate XO for the dac (cheers for that one Leo!) but at the moment I really very chuffed with myself, as this is my first circuit that I have designed by myself, instead of riding on the coat-tails of others. Please excuse the state of the soldering, and repaired tracks, as it's really had a hammering!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2011 21:58:16 GMT
I've wanted to design and make my own dac for a while, purely because I'm not clever enough at analogue electronics to design something useful. The ess 9022 sabre dac was released last year, and being cheap (about a £1) to buy, and having an audio out, I thought it looked nice and simple to start with. The only drawback is that it only accepted an I2S signal, and I only have spdif easily available. So I also had to figure out how to use a spdif transceiver. I chose the Wolfson WM8804 chip, as it seems a good spec, relatively cheap and also uses the same supply voltage as the dac chip (3.3 Volts). I also figured that I would configure the receiver to accept up to 24/192 signals, so that I could use it with my SC Dac. Well, I built up the first one, and got crackles, which was a bit of a bugger, but after changing the wm8804 for a new one, the dac works. I've just got it going, and it's working well from my cd player. The output of the dac easily powers my philips test headphones at quite a good level, and the test cd of Master of Puppets, by Metallica, is really sounding quite nice. There's a few more things I want to try, including integral volco, and a seperate XO for the dac (cheers for that one Leo!) but at the moment I really very chuffed with myself, as this is my first circuit that I have designed by myself, instead of riding on the coat-tails of others. Please excuse the state of the soldering, and repaired tracks, as it's really had a hammering! Hi Will Well done ! More details on what you are using on the supply board ? Alex
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jonclancy
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Post by jonclancy on Jan 25, 2011 22:03:44 GMT
Hi Will, That looks a bit nifty!! I like the minimal parts count as well!
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Will
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Post by Will on Jan 25, 2011 22:18:47 GMT
Thanks Guys! Yep, not many parts, which is quite nice. I have put provision for a spdif transformer in, so that I can have a look at the signal pre and after, to see what gives. Unfortunately my scope got all hot and bothered this evening, and stopped working, which is a pain, so I can't check that at the moment. Parts count is 6*10k, 1*75R, 1*4k7, 3*33R minimelf resisitors, 1*12Mhz osc, 2*22pF ceramic, 1*100nF cap and 6*1uF caps, on top of the two IC's For supplies I've used a LE33C per supply rail, which is powered by a 9V battery, to test the circuit. It's similar to the LM78xx series to implement. Not the best by a long stretch, but good for testing. The wm8804 has two supplies, and the ess9022 has one. They can all be fed from the one 3.3V supply, or you can go all fancy pants and supply each rail individually. I've very surprised how well it drives headphones directly, to be honest
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2011 22:22:06 GMT
Well done Will, must give a great sense of achievement to design and build from the ground up!
Syd
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joethearachnid
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Post by joethearachnid on Jan 25, 2011 22:31:26 GMT
Okay, you can consider my interest to be pretty well piqued. I'm very interested to see what you come up with...
-JoetheArachnid
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Post by jeffc on Jan 26, 2011 3:40:36 GMT
Excellent Will, Looks like you're following up on Patrick's (EUVL) discovery and implementation of this chip with the QLS QA-550 SD card player, post #89 here. www.diyaudio.com/forums/digital-source/150199-qa-550-sd-card-16-44-1-wav-transport-9.htmlWhen you mentioned a "simple" Sabre DAC, I immediately thought of this thread. Apparently the DAC chip sounds great and it will be very interested to see how it fares against more upmarket chips. cheers..jeffc
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2011 4:45:54 GMT
Jeff Like the NFB-12's Dual WM8741 chips ? Still, I suspect that Audio GD was not able to tame the NFB11 sufficiently to continue with it in their inventory , as at least on paper it had the potential to annihilate the NFB12 as far as accurate sound quality is concerned .Perhaps they thought people would prefer the usual warm AudioGD style of presentation ? Alex
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Will
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Post by Will on Jan 26, 2011 7:51:10 GMT
Thanks for the further kind words, guys.
Jeff, the first I heard about it was when John Kenny connected one to the I2S out from a hiface, and I went form there. I only heard about EUVL's pcb the day after I'd sent off the pcb files for manufacturing. I then saw how straightforward it would be to implement using a 50Mhz XO for the dac, which apparently take SQ up a notch (it currently take MCLK form the receiver). This is easy to do on my pcb, as I've left access points for the I2S points. If there was enough interest to do another run of boards (I did 5, to try it out) then I'd be implementing what I find during my bodging.
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Post by jeffc on Jan 26, 2011 12:30:24 GMT
Yer OK Alex, Looks like I'm going to have send you my NFB12 too whenever it appears so that those dual WM8741 chips used on mono so you get a first-hand experience of how feckin' good it will sound. Seriously, for US$200 I don’t expect miracles but I also don’t expect it will be embarrassed either by any DAC including my DSD1796 SC-DAC or DACs based on the top-of-the-range Sabre chip. Will, once up and going I’m sure this DAC chip will sound promising enough that you’ll be considering what to implement in a MK2 PCB. cheers..jeffc
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toad
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Post by toad on Jan 26, 2011 12:37:28 GMT
I can only look on in awe at the skills some of you guys have Nice one Will!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2011 12:49:24 GMT
I can only look on in awe at the skills some of you guys have Nice one Will! x2, Well done Will, very nice work, great to be able to make something like that with good results. Mick.
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jonclancy
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Post by jonclancy on Jan 26, 2011 14:06:24 GMT
SORRY - DISREGARD. Wrong info posted!! Cheers Jon
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Spirit
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Post by Spirit on Jan 26, 2011 15:01:46 GMT
Looking good Will! "Will's Sabre Dac Prototype" I like it
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Will
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Post by Will on Jan 26, 2011 20:00:32 GMT
For info: 2 C-EU050-055X075 C12, C13 6 C-EU050-075X075 C4, C5, C8, C9, C10, C11 3 CPOL-EUE2-5 C20, C21, C22 1 ESS9022 IC2 2 0R R-EU_0207/10 R15, R16 1 4k7 R-EU_MELF0204W R14 13 10k R-EU_MELF0204W R1, R2, R3, R4, R5, R6, R7, R8, R9, R10, R11, R12, R13 1 12Mhz CRYSTALHC49U70 Q1 2 22pF C-EU025-025X050 C6, C7 3 100nF C-EU025-050X050 C1, C2, C3 1 S22083 S22083 U$2 1 WM8804 WM8804 U$1 I take it the 6 identical films are 1uF. Could you ID C12 and 13 for me, please? Cheers Jon Errr, I wouldn't go by the values in the eagle file, as they are properly wrong, very fluid as they say. I'm working on a tidy version to post, but will send you and t'other's a component list, so that you can build it up. One thing I did forget to mention is a big thanks to Jon for yet again creating the Eagle models, this time for the wm8804 and ess9022. He really is a top man
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Will
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Post by Will on Jan 26, 2011 20:02:42 GMT
The other thing I've found is that this ess9022 is used in the nuforce uDac.
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jonclancy
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Post by jonclancy on Jan 26, 2011 22:39:43 GMT
I'm working on a tidy version to post, but will send you and t'other's a component list, so that you can build it up. One thing I did forget to mention is a big thanks to Jon for yet again creating the Eagle models, this time for the wm8804 and ess9022. He really is a top man Why thank you!! 'Snow problem at all, and good fun too!
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Will
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Post by Will on Jan 27, 2011 12:44:35 GMT
A bit more info on the dac.
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jkeny
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Post by jkeny on Jan 27, 2011 18:44:06 GMT
Well done Will, a much overlooked DAC probably because it uses an op-amp output stage but the NDA of ESS may well have something to do with this also!
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Will
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Post by Will on Feb 1, 2011 11:06:24 GMT
And eventually, the circuit for the dac. Attachments:
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leo
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Post by leo on Feb 2, 2011 0:11:45 GMT
Had the little bugger up and running for a couple of days now, wanted to get it knocked up to try with the APE SD card player Mike sent me to try out. Sounding pretty damn good for such a cheapo, well done and thanks Will Voltages came from Teddy regs to start with, I'm now currently trying the A123 batteries which in my opinion sound a little better than the Teddy regs in this application. Obviously will try other options later. as well as other tinkering. It was real hard work trying to load and upload pics with this damn netbook so hope the pic displays ok
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Post by jkeny on Feb 2, 2011 0:51:39 GMT
Leo, Did you try the SD card with I2S out? Maybe it will be easy to connect it to this DAC -looks like there are some pads? A123s working out here Nice board Will -looks real purdy!
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Post by leo on Feb 2, 2011 1:06:26 GMT
Hi John, Only had it running a couple of days so not had much time to try a lot yet. You are right though, I2S would be easy with this dac, also the small size has the advantage of short leads.
I personally prefer the batteries over the Teddy regs with Wills dac, not tried anything else just yet to compare.
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Will
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Post by Will on Feb 2, 2011 9:33:27 GMT
Had the little bugger up and running for a couple of days now, wanted to get it knocked up to try with the APE SD card player Mike sent me to try out. Sounding pretty damn good for such a cheapo, well done and thanks Will Voltages came from Teddy regs to start with, I'm now currently trying the A123 batteries which in my opinion sound a little better than the Teddy regs in this application. Obviously will try other options later. as well as other tinkering. It was real hard work trying to load and upload pics with this damn netbook so hope the pic displays ok Blimey, Leo, looks a million times better than mine! Some may have noticed that I uploaded a low-res picture, to make it harder to see my soldering Still some bits to tinker with, as you say, and I've still to try any hi-res files with it. I know leaving the caps as thru-hole is a bit strange, but I think it does give options to people, and the improves the bodge-ability of the pcb. Do you have a part number for the pcb pins, by the way?
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Will
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Post by Will on Feb 2, 2011 9:40:12 GMT
Leo, Did you try the SD card with I2S out? Maybe it will be easy to connect it to this DAC -looks like there are some pads? A123s working out here Nice board Will -looks real purdy! Thanks John! I purposefully left the output of the wm8804 easy to get at, and also the input to the 9022. I want to try a 50Mhz XO, local to the 9022, but by also having the mclck signal input to the dac easily available, you can run it from the same clock as your source (which I think you prefer) The other use for this pcb apart from using it as a dac, is to use it as a 24/196 capable receiver. I've set it for that in hardware mode (I'll leave software and uC's for another day!), for use in my SC dac.
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